[Deer Program Public Education Session on October 8, 2026.]
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MY NAME IS JACKIE ADLER, AND THIS IS BRUCE EDWARDS.
AND WE'RE PART OF THE CITY'S COMMUNICATIONS TEAM.
WE WILL BE FACILITATING TONIGHT'S COMMUNITY CONVERSATION ABOUT DR.
FIRST, THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE.
PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT IS A TOP PRIORITY FOR EVERYTHING WE DO HERE IN DUBLIN, NO MATTER THE TOPIC.
WE BELIEVE THE BEST DECISIONS ARE INFORMED BY LISTENING, LEARNING, AND HEARING DIRECTLY FROM OUR COMMUNITY.
TONIGHT IS PART OF THAT COMMITMENT TO KEEPING OUR COMMUNITY INFORMED AND ENGAGED.
WE'RE GONNA START BY PROVIDING SOME BACKGROUND ON HOW WE GOT HERE, THE RESEARCH, RESIDENT FEEDBACK, COMMUNITY CONVERSATIONS, UH, THAT HAVE SHAPED THIS DISCUSSION OVER THE LAST SEVERAL YEARS.
AND THEN WE'LL EXPLAIN HOW THE PROGRAM WILL WORK, THE SAFEGUARDS THAT'LL BE IN PLACE.
AND THEN WE'LL OPEN THE FLOOR FOR SOME QUESTIONS.
WE ASK THAT YOU PLEASE HOLD YOUR QUESTIONS UNTIL THE END.
WE'LL BE HANDING OUT COMMENT CARDS IF YOU NEED ONE, OR YOU MIGHT HAVE GOTTEN ONE AS YOU WALK THROUGH THE DOOR, BUT YOU CAN WRITE DOWN YOUR QUESTION DURING OUR PANEL DISCUSSION.
AND AFTER THAT, OUR FRIENDS FROM MURPHY, EPSON, MARIE, AND JONATHAN WILL BE AROUND TO COLLECT THOSE CARDS.
PLEASE, THROUGHOUT THE EVENING, BE POLITE, RESPECTFUL, AND KIND.
OUR GOAL TONIGHT IS UNDERSTANDING.
WE WANT TO MAKE SURE QUESTIONS ARE HEARD, INFORMATION IS SHARED, AND EVERYONE LEAVES WITH A CLEAR UNDERSTANDING OF THE ISSUE, THE DATA, AND THE PROCESS MOVING FORWARD TO HELP ANSWER QUESTIONS.
THIS EVENING, WE ARE JOINED BY PANELS OF THE CITY'S DEER MANAGEMENT PROGRAM.
WE HAVE EXPERTS AND SUBJECT MATTERS.
WE HAVE DUBLIN'S, BARBARA RAY, OUR WILDLIFE AND NATURE EDUCATION COORDINATOR, DEPUTY CHIEF NICK TABERNAC OF THE DUBLIN POLICE, AND GREG HIES, SUSAN WITH THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY.
UH, WE'LL HAVE THEM ON OUR PANEL IN JUST A FEW MINUTES, BUT FIRST WE'RE GOING TO TURN OVER TO MITCH AMEN, CITY OF DUBLIN, MANAGEMENT ANALYST.
MY NAME IS MITCH AMON, AND LIKE JACKIE SAID, I'M A MANAGEMENT ANALYST HERE AT THE CITY OF DUBLIN.
AND I'M GONNA GIVE A A BROAD OVERVIEW OF, UH, THE THE 2026 DEER MANAGEMENT PROGRAM AND, UH, KIND OF THE, THE DECISION MAKING PROCESS THAT LED US TO WHERE WE ARE TODAY.
SO BEFORE ELABORATING ON THE DECISION MAKING PROCESS AND THE CONSIDERATIONS MADE TO ESTABLISH A DEER MANAGEMENT PROGRAM HERE IN DUBLIN, UH, AT THE RECOMMENDATION OF CITY COUNCIL STAFF DEVELOPED AN ETHICAL STATEMENT, WHICH, UH, A A PORTION OF THAT IS ON SCREEN.
IT'S INTENDED TO REINFORCE THAT THE CITY REMAINS COMMITTED TO TRANSPARENCY AND COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT.
SO OUR GOAL IS TO SUPPORT A BALANCED ECOSYSTEM WHILE MAINTAINING THE QUALITY OF LIFE AND SAFETY THAT DEFINES OUR EXCEPTIONAL COMMUNITY.
ANOTHER FACTOR TO KEEP IN MIND IS THAT DUBLIN'S ECOSYSTEM AND DEER POPULATION WOULD BE SIGNIFICANTLY IMPACTED IF THE HERD WERE TO BE ALLOWED, UH, OR WERE ALLOWED THE OPPORTUNITY, EXCUSE ME, TO GROW INTO A STATE OF OVERPOPULATION.
SPECIFIC ECOLOGICAL IMPACTS INCLUDE EXCESSIVE BROWSING THAT COULD LEAD TO REDUCED BIODIVERSITY, PREVENTING THE GROWTH OF NATIVE PLANTS, REDUCING HABITAT FOR BIRDS, POLLINATORS, AND OTHER WILDLIFE, WHILE ALSO LEADING TO POOR HEALTH, UH, AND INCREASED DISEASE AND MORE AGGRESSIVE BEHAVIOR IN THE DEER POPULATION ITSELF.
RESIDENTS HAVE REPORTED A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER OF INTERACTIONS WITH AGGRESSIVE DEER THAT INCLUDE DEER ATTACKING, STOMPING KICKING, GORING, CHARGING OR OTHERWISE INJURING A PET, STALKING AND CHASING PETS AND THEIR OWNERS, AS WELL AS DAMAGE TO PROPERTY IN GENERAL.
SO THE DECISION MAKING PROCESS THAT I'VE BEEN REFERENCING, WHICH LED TO CITY COUNCIL'S ADOPTION OF RESOLUTION 28 26, AUTHORIZING A CONTRACT WITH USDA FOR A DEER MANAGEMENT PROGRAM, SPANNED MULTIPLE YEARS AND INCLUDED MANY PUBLIC MEETINGS, THE FIRST OF WHICH ARE LISTED ON SCREEN HERE, FOLLOWING A RESIDENT SURVEY POSTED ON JANUARY 6TH AND OPEN FOR PUBLIC FEEDBACK FOR A TOTAL OF SEVEN WEEKS, THE CITY CATALOG RESPONSES, WHICH DETERMINED THAT OF THE 3,600 PLUS RESPONDENTS, 59% THOUGHT THAT THE DEER POPULATION SHOULD BE MANAGED.
AND OF THOSE SAME 3,600 RESPONSES, 49 WERE IN SUPPORT OF LETHAL MESS OF THE USE OF LETHAL METHODS, UM, TO RE TO REGULATE THAT LOCAL DEER POPULATION WITH 18%.
NEITHER SUPPORTING NOR OPPOSING PUBLIC MEETINGS.
CONSIDERING RESIDENT SURVEY RESPONSES WERE HELD AS THE WINDOW FOR SUBMITTING PUBLIC FEEDBACK CAME TO A CLOSE AS WELL AS SUBSEQUENT TO ITS CLOSING.
DURING THIS THREE MONTH PERIOD, TWO DEAR POPULATION INDEX SURVEYS WERE COMPLETED AND THESE LEVERAGED TECHNIQUES PREVIOUSLY UTILIZED BY ORGANIZATIONS IN THE REGION SIMILARLY TO THE FORMAT OF THIS MEETING, AN INFORMATIONAL PRESENTATION
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WAS MADE TO CITY COUNCIL.AND FOLLOWING THAT PRESENTATION, COUNCIL MEMBERS THEN HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO ASK QUESTIONS OF OUTSIDE EXPERTS LIKE WE HAVE HERE WITH US TODAY.
THE CITYWIDE DEER POPULATION INDEX SURVEY COUNTED APPROXIMATELY 528 DEER, UH, BY FLYING TWO HIGH RESOLUTION THERMAL IMAGING DRONES IN THE EVENING FROM FRIDAY TO MONDAY IN LATE APRIL OF THIS YEAR.
SO THE ZONES WHERE DUBLIN POLICE FLEW A SIMILAR INDEX SURVEY IN FEBRUARY, UM, KIND OF REFLECTED THE SAME RESULTS THAT, THAT THIS INDEX, UM, RESULTED IN AND FOUND POCKETS OF, UH, MORE DENSE DEER POPULATIONS IN SIMILAR AREAS.
FINDINGS FROM THESE SURVEYS WERE SENT TO THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE TO INFORM REMOVAL LOCATION DISCUSSIONS.
I'D LIKE TO EMPHASIZE THAT THIS SURVEY AND OTHER POPULATION SURVEY INDEXES ARE MERELY A SNAPSHOT OF THE POPULATION AT A SINGLE MOMENT IN TIME.
UM, DEER ARE VERY, VERY MUCH A TRANSIENT SPECIES, AND THEY CONSISTENTLY MIGRATE AN AREA OF APPROXIMATELY FIVE SQUARE MILES COUNCIL DIRECTION AND UNANIMOUS APPROVAL OF A CONTRACT WITH THE USDA ALONG WITH A RECENT ORDINANCE.
WAIVING CODE SECTION 91 0 8 FOR QUALIFYING PROPERTIES CONCLUDED THE LEGISLATIVE APPROVAL PROCESS FOR THE PROGRAM IN LATE SEPTEMBER.
THE PUBLIC PROCESS OUTLINED IN THE PREVIOUS SLIDES LED TO THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A COMPREHENSIVE DEER MANAGEMENT PROGRAM OR A DEER MANAGEMENT STRATEGY, EXCUSE ME.
UM, IN THAT STRATEGY, THE CITY IS UTILIZING MANY TOOLS IN THE BROADER DEER MANAGEMENT TOOLKIT.
SO THAT INCLUDES OUTDOOR FEED ORDINANCE, AN OUTDOOR FEED ORDINANCE THAT WAS, UH, ADOPTED IN 2024.
A NATURE EDUCATION COORDINATOR DEDICATED TO PROVIDING COMMUNITY EDUCATION REGARDING WILDLIFE COEXISTENCE.
AND YOU'LL HEAR FROM HER LATER BARBARA RAY ON THE PANEL, UM, AS WELL AS DEER RESISTANT LANDSCAPING GUIDANCE.
AND THEN OUR TARGETED REMOVAL PROGRAM IN WHICH TRAINED AND LICENSED WILDLIFE MANAGEMENT PROFESSIONALS FROM THE USDA WILL BEGIN CONDUCTED DEER CONDUCTING TARGETED DEER REMOVAL.
THE CITY'S HIGHEST PRIORITY IN THE ADMINISTRATION OF THIS PROGRAM IS PUBLIC SAFETY, ESPECIALLY ENSURING SAFE REMOVAL OPERATIONS BY THOSE TRAINED LICENSED PROFESSIONALS.
UM, DUBLIN POLICE WILL PROVIDE AN ESCORT TO THOSE PROFESSIONALS TO ENSURE THE DESIGNATED AREAS CLEAR BEFORE OPERATIONS COMMENCE.
THERE WILL BE SIGNAGE AT THESE REMOVAL AREAS, AND DEER WILL BE TRANSPORTED OFFSITE FOR PROCESSING AWAY FROM THE PUBLIC VIEW.
THE USDA HAS STRATEGICALLY DETERMINED THE VIABILITY OF THE REMOVAL SITES, PREDOMINANTLY LEVERAGING CITY OWNED LAND BASED ON QUANTITATIVE DATA.
AND IN PARTNERSHIP WITH THE DUBLIN POLICE DEPARTMENT, THE PROGRAM ENCOMPASSES 21 PROPERTIES, THAT INCLUDES NINE OPEN SPACE AND RESERVE AREAS, NINE CITY PARKS, AND THREE NON-RESIDENTIAL PRIVATE PROPERTIES.
SO BEAR WITH ME AS I GO THROUGH THE, THE NAMES OF THE OPEN SPACES AND PARKS, AS WELL AS THE PRIVATE PROPERTY.
THE OPEN SPACE AND RESERVE AREAS INCLUDE TARTAN WEST OPEN SPACE, AC AND D DUBLIN SHIRE, OPEN SPACE F SCOTTISH CORNERS, WOODS OPEN SPACE RIVIERA RESERVE, D ONE, D TWO, AND J TWO.
BRANDON OPEN SPACE A AND B HUTCHINS OPEN SPACE, THE WOODS OF INDIAN RUN, THE DUBLIN SHIRE GREENWAY, AND THE ML RED TRABU NATURE RESERVE.
WITH THAT, THE PARK PROPERTIES THAT ARE INCLUDED ARE SHANNON GLENN, AVERY, INDIAN RUN MEADOWS, ARLINGTON, BRANDON WELLINGTON, COVENTRY WOODS, THADDEUS COSCO, AND CCIO PARK.
FINALLY, THE THREE NON-RESIDENTIAL PRIVATE PROPERTIES ARE ALL ASSOCIATED WITH MURFIELD VILLAGE GOLF CLUB.
THE GOLF COURSE PROPERTY ITSELF, THE CROSSGATE PARKING LOT PROPERTY, AND THE DUBLIN ROAD PARKING LOT PROPERTY TARGETED REMOVAL WILL COMMENCE ON NOVEMBER ONE AND WILL OCCUR ON AN INTERMITTENT AND AS NEEDED BASIS UNTIL MARCH 31.
RESIDENTS WILL BE NOTIFIED VIA CITYWIDE MAILER SIGNS POSTED AT REMOVAL AREAS, CITY WEBSITE AND SOCIAL MEDIA ENGAGEMENT, AS WELL AS HOA OUTREACH.
FINALLY, IN FURTHERANCE OF OUR VISION TO BE THE MOST SUSTAINABLE AND RESILIENT GLOBAL CITY OF CHOICE, THE EXCESS ORGANIC MATERIAL WILL BE COMPOSTED AND ALL VENISON WILL BE DONATED TO THE DUBLIN FOOD PANTRY.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH, AND I'LL HAND IT OFF TO MARIE OR BRUCE.
THANKS, MITCH, AND THANK YOU TO OUR PANELISTS FOR BEING HERE TONIGHT.
WE'RE GONNA START WITH YOU WITH THIS FIRST QUESTION.
FOR ANYONE WHO WASN'T AT OUR FIRST MEETING, CAN YOU BRIEFLY EXPLAIN WHY MANAGING DUBLIN'S DEER POPULATION IS IMPORTANT? WHAT HAPPENS ENVIRONMENTALLY AND FROM A PUBLIC SAFETY PERSPECTIVE WHEN DEER POPULATIONS BECOME TOO HIGH? YEAH, THANKS.
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QUESTION TO KICK OFF WITH, ONE THING WE SHOULD JUST REMEMBER IS 120 YEARS AGO, WE HAD ZERO DEER IN THE WILD IN OHIO.UM, THE ONLY ONES WE HAD WERE AT THE CLEVELAND ZOO, SO THEY'D BEEN ELIMINATED.
AND SO DEER MANAGEMENT FOR A LOT OF YEARS IN OHIO MEANT TRYING TO GET OUR DEER BACK ON THE LANDSCAPE.
SO HUNTING, REGULATIONS AND ALL SORTS OF, UH, OTHER POLICIES WERE CREATED AND DECADES WERE SPENT TRYING TO RETURN DEER TO THE LANDSCAPE.
SO THAT SUCCESS STORY LAYS THE FOUNDATION FOR WHAT'S GOING ON.
THE SUCCESSES ACTUALLY CONTINUED ON A PARTICULAR TRAJECTORY.
UM, AND CONTRARY TO WHAT WE KIND OF THINK ABOUT, UH, SUBURBAN AREAS CAN HOLD WAY MORE DEER THAN NATURAL FOREST AREAS.
SO ACTUALLY, OUR DEVELOPMENT OF OUR RESIDENTIAL AREAS WITH OUR GARDENS AND OUR TASTY LANDSCAPING THAT WE REPLACE WHEN DEER EAT, IT CREATES SORT OF A SMORGASBORD THAT HOLDS 10 TIMES MORE DEER THAN WOULD NATURALLY BE ON THE LANDSCAPE IN A FOREST.
SO THAT HAS SORT OF HAPPENED AND HAS CREATED A SITUATION WHERE DEER POPULATIONS HAVE GONE UP AND UP AND UP, TYPICALLY ACROSS THE STATE.
DEER ARE MANAGED BECAUSE HUNTERS WANNA SEE MORE DEER AND FARMERS WANNA SEE LESS DEER.
AND IT'S BEEN A BALANCE AT THE STATE LEVEL, RIGHT? BUT IN THE MEANTIME, SOME COMMUNITIES 30, 40 YEARS AGO START MANAGING DEER, PARTICULARLY BECAUSE OF DEER VEHICLE COLLISIONS.
AND THIS IS PARTICULARLY TRUE, WHERE YOU HAVE HIGHWAYS THAT INTERSECT WITH, YOU KNOW, HIGH VOLUME DEER CORRIDORS.
AND SO THESE ARE PLACES WHERE DEER ARE GETTING HIT BY CARS, AND THERE'S LOTS OF HUMAN HEALTH RISKS THERE, AND ACCIDENTS AND, AND DEATHS AND THOSE KINDS OF THINGS.
UM, WHAT WE'RE SEEING NOW IN THE LAST 15, 20 YEARS, AND THIS IS TRUE ACROSS THE COUNTRY AND ESPECIALLY ACROSS THE MIDWEST, IS THIS, THE, THE POPULATION OF DEER IN OUR SUBURBAN AREAS IS KIND OF SNEAKING UP ON US AND SURPRISING US A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE WE KIND OF THOUGHT, OH, WELL, THERE SHOULDN'T BE SO MANY DEER.
BUT IT'S LIKE, NO, ACTUALLY THERE'S MORE DEER, RIGHT? SO WHAT WE'RE STARTING TO SEE, PART OF IT'S THE PLANT AND VEGETATION ISSUES, SOME OF WHICH MITCH ALREADY TALKED ABOUT.
SO MANY DEER ON THE LANDSCAPE MEAN THEY'RE BROWSING THE UNDERSTORY.
THEY'RE BROWSING WILDFLOWERS, THEY'RE BROWSING A LOT OF NATIVE PLANTS THAT WOULD OTHERWISE BE THERE.
THEY'RE BROWSING SHRUBS, FORBES.
THAT OF COURSE, MEANS THAT A LOT OF THE INSECTS AND ARTHROPODS AND OTHER THINGS THAT ARE, YOU KNOW, PART OF THAT ECOSYSTEM, MAYBE THAT'S POLLINATORS ARE DISAPPEARING AS WELL.
WITH SOME OF THOSE PLANTS, THE ROOTS OF THOSE PLANTS WILL HOLD SOIL.
AND SO SOMETIMES SOIL EROSION AND OTHER WATER QUALITY ISSUES ARE CROPPING UP.
AND THERE ARE STUDIES AROUND THE STATE THAT SHOW SOME OF THIS.
THESE ARE KIND OF, YOU KNOW, SUBTLE ECOLOGICAL INDICATORS THAT NOT EVERY COMMUNITY IS GONNA MEASURE THAT KIND OF STUFF, BUT THAT'S THE BIG PICTURE.
AND I THINK WHERE WE'VE SEEN IT THE MOST IS IN THE EXCLUSION STUDIES IN SOME OF THE METRO PARKS WHERE YOU CAN SEE WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE WHEN DEER BROWSE VERSUS WHERE THEY CAN'T BROWSE.
IT'S JUST TOTALLY NIGHT AND DAY, RIGHT.
SO, AS WE SAY IN WORTHINGTON, 'CAUSE I'VE WORKED A LOT WITH THE WORTHINGTON EFFORTS TO JUGGLE THIS ISSUE AND TRY TO FIGURE OUT WHAT TO DO ABOUT DEER POPULATIONS LIFETIME GARDENERS IN WORTHINGTON WERE BASICALLY SAYING, I'VE BEEN GARDENING FOR 30, 40 YEARS, AND IN THE LAST FIVE TO 10 YEARS, I CAN'T PLANT ANYTHING.
NOT EVEN DEER RESISTANT SPECIES.
THE DEER ARE JUST EATING IT ALL.
UM, SO IT'S NOT, AND THERE'S, NOBODY WANTS TO ELIMINATE DEER.
WELL, THERE'S A FEW PEOPLE THAT SEE DEER MAINLY AS A NUISANCE THAT MIGHT WANNA ELIMINATE DEER, BUT THAT IS NOT POSSIBLE, NOR DESIRABLE.
AND DEER ARE A REALLY IMPORTANT PART OF THE LANDSCAPE.
I THINK THEY ADD TO PEOPLE'S QUALITY OF LIFE.
IT'S PART OF YOUR PROPERTY VALUES, THE CHANCE TO SEE WILDLIFE, BUT THE IDEA IS TO BRING DEER POPULATIONS DOWN TO A MORE BALANCED LEVEL SO THAT THIS OVER BROWSE DOESN'T HAPPEN.
AND THEN SOME OF THE CONFLICTS WITH HUMANS THAT WE SEE, SOME OF THE AGGRESSIVE DEER BEHAVIOR ATTACKS ON PETS, ON PEOPLE, LANDSCAPE DAMAGE, UH, PROPERTY DAMAGE AND DEER VEHICLE COLLISIONS TO SOME EXTENT IN A COMMUNITY LIKE DUBLIN.
THOSE ARE ALL THINGS THAT WE START TO SEE.
AND YOU MIGHT HAVE TOUCHED ON THIS A LITTLE BIT IN YOUR ANSWER, BUT JUST A FOLLOW UP.
HOW DO WILDLIFE PROFESSIONALS DETERMINE WHEN A DEER POPULATION HAS BECOME TOO LARGE FOR, FOR, FOR A PARTICULAR COMMUNITY OR ECOSYSTEM? YEAH.
SO, UH, I ALLUDED TO SOME OF THIS ALREADY, BUT, UH, IT'S KIND OF NUANCED TO, TO MEASURE SOME OF THESE ECOLOGICAL FACTORS THAT HAS MORE TO DO WITH, I THINK, LANDSCAPE ECOLOGISTS THAT ARE WATCHING THINGS, YOU KNOW, SORT OF BIGGER PICTURE.
UM, AND FRANKLY, WHAT WE'RE REALLY DOING IS NOT LOOKING SO MUCH AT BIOLOGICAL CARING CAPACITY, BUT SOCIAL CARING CAPACITY.
SO THAT'S REALLY THE KEY HERE.
BIOLOGICAL CARING CAPACITY SAYS, GOSH, HOW MANY DEER CAN THE LANDSCAPE HOLD? AND WHEN WE JUST HAVE TOO MANY DEER IN THE LANDSCAPE AND THEIR POPULATION STARTS TO CRASH BECAUSE THEY'VE OVER BROWSED, THEY'VE EATEN UP TOO MUCH STUFF, THEY'VE DESTROYED HABITAT JUST BECAUSE THERE'S SO MANY DEER OR MAYBE THERE'S TOO MUCH DISEASE, THEN YOU SEE COLLAPSES IN POPULATIONS.
AND WE DON'T WANNA GET TO THAT LEVEL, RIGHT? UM, WE WOULD NEVER WANT IT TO GET TO THE POINT OF BIOLOGICAL CARING CAPACITY, 'CAUSE WE KNOW THINGS ARE GONNA SHUT DOWN AT THAT POINT.
SO SOCIAL CARING CAPACITY IS WHEN WE START TO HIT SOME OF THE LIMITS OF SOCIAL TOLERANCE.
AND THOSE ARE SOME OF THOSE OTHER INDICATORS THAT, FRANKLY, THAT WE DO LOOK AT, RIGHT? IT'S, IT'S NOT AS THOUGH WE TAKE A MAGICAL NUMBER OF HOW MANY DEER THERE SHOULD BE.
AND WE SAY, OKAY, WELL LET'S MAKE SURE THERE'S ONLY THAT MANY
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DEER.THAT'S NOT HOW DEER ARE MANAGED IN OHIO AT ALL.
UM, SO WE LOOK AT THE QUESTION OF, YOU KNOW, HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE COMPLAINING OF AGGRESSIVE DEER THAT ARE ATTACKING THEM? IN WORTHINGTON, WE HAD TWO LADIES COME TO OUR DEER TASK FORCE MEETINGS AND TALK ABOUT BEING HOSPITALIZED BY BEING ATTACKED BY A DOUGH WHILE THEY WERE WALKING THEIR DOG.
UM, AND ONE OF THEM WHOM WAS A VETERINARIAN WHO'S VERY FAMILIAR WITH ANIMAL BEHAVIOR, RIGHT? SO THINGS LIKE THAT, YOU START SEEING, WHICH THERE'S BEEN MORE OF THAT IN DUBLIN THAN IN WORTHINGTON, FRANKLY.
UM, THE DEER CARCASS REMOVAL REQUESTS, UM, FOR THE, FOR THE PUBLIC UTILITIES OR WHOEVER GOES OUT AND DOES THOSE SERVICE REQUESTS, CALLS TO THE POLICE FOR DEALING WITH DEER, UM, HARASSMENT OF ANIMALS.
WE HAD A LOT OF PEOPLE IN WORTHINGTON COME AND SAY, WE GOT SO MANY DEER IN MY BACKYARD, AND I CANNOT HAZE THEM.
I CANNOT SCARE THEM OUTTA MY BACKYARD ANYMORE.
I DON'T LET MY DOGS OUT THERE ANYMORE.
THERE'S DEER POOP ALL OVER THE PLACE.
I WON'T LET MY GRANDKIDS OUT TO PLAY IN THE BACKYARD.
I CANNOT GET THE DEER OUTTA MY YARD.
AND WE HEARD THAT STORY OVER AND OVER AND OVER.
SO SOME OF THOSE KINDS OF INDICATORS, THESE INDICATORS OF THE LIMITS OF SOCIAL TOLERANCE, AND OF COURSE THE GARDENERS WHO ARE LIKE, I CAN'T PLANT ANYTHING ANYMORE.
UM, SO THOSE ARE THE KINDS OF MEASURES THAT I THINK WE SEE AN AWFUL LOT OF.
GREG, I'LL, I'LL FOLLOW UP WITH ANOTHER QUESTION WITH YOU.
UM, BEYOND SIMPLY COUNTING DEER, WHAT CHANGES SHOULD DUBLIN LOOK FORWARD TO KNOW THE PROGRAM IS WORKING? YEAH, I, I, THAT'S A REALLY IMPORTANT QUESTION, UH, BECAUSE THE NUMBER OF DEER IS HARD TO ESTIMATE SO FAR IN WORTHINGTON, WE'VE HAD PEOPLE SAY, OH, THANK YOU FOR REMOVING SOME DEER.
I CAN SEE THAT THERE ARE LESS.
WE'VE HAD OTHER PEOPLE WHO'VE SAID, I'M FRUSTRATED, THERE'S STILL TOO MANY DEER.
CAN YOU PLEASE TAKE MORE? IT CAN BE HARD FROM ANY ONE RESIDENTIAL STANDPOINT TO, YOU KNOW, KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE NUMBER OF DEER.
UM, BUT THERE ARE THESE LARGER PATTERNS.
I, I HEARD BARBARA TALKING ABOUT THE DEER BROWSE LINE THAT YOU CAN SEE ACROSS A FIELD, AND YOU SEE THAT THE LEAVES DON'T START TILL SIX FEET UP ACROSS THE FAR SIDE OF THE FIELD.
WHY IS THAT? IS THAT BECAUSE LEAVES DON'T GROW LOWER THAN SIX FEET HIGH ON TREES? NO, THAT'S BECAUSE THE DEER CAN REACH THAT HIGH AND THEY'VE EATEN EVERYTHING THERE, RIGHT? SO WHEN YOU SEE THAT DEER BROWSE LINE, IT'S AN INDICATION THAT, WOW, THE DEER HAVE KIND OF OVERWHELMED EVERYTHING BELOW SIX FEET IN THIS PARTICULAR AREA.
SO YOU MIGHT SEE A REDUCTION IN THINGS LIKE DEER BROWSE LINES.
UM, YOU MIGHT SEE, UM, EVIDENCE OF JUST SAPLING SURVIVAL TOO, RIGHT? THAT'S WHERE THESE EXCLUSION STUDIES IN THE METRO PARKS, BOTH IN CLEVELAND AND IN COLUMBUS AND FRANKLIN COUNTY, YOU PUT UP A FENCE, YOU KEEP THE DEER OUT, AND THEN YOU TAKE PICTURES OF WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE BEFORE AND AFTER, YOU KNOW, SIX MONTHS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
AND IT'S NIGHT AND DAY ON THE SIDE WHERE THE DEER, YOU KNOW, CAN GO, WHERE THEY'RE NOT FENCED OUT.
IT'S LIKE SOMEONE WENT IN THERE WITH A WEED WHACKER AND JUST TOOK EVERYTHING OUT AND ON THE SIDE WHERE THE FENCE IS THERE AND THE DEER HAVEN'T BEEN ABLE TO COME IN AND OVER BROWSE.
OH MY GOSH, THERE'S ALL THIS STUFF GROWING AND ALL THESE SAPLINGS AND ALL THIS.
SO, UM, TREE GEN REGENERATION IS SOMETHING THAT YOU'D SEE.
THE WORTHINGTON ARBOR COMMITTEE WAS REALLY KIND OF FRUSTRATED 'CAUSE THEY LOST THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS OF PLANTED TREES, PRETTY MUCH ALL THE TREES THEY PLANTED LAST YEAR ALONG SIDEWALKS AND ALL THAT.
AND THEY HAD DEER, YOU KNOW, PROTECTION FOR THE DEER AROUND ALL THESE TREES.
THE DEER FIGURED OUT HOW TO DESTROY THE PROTECTIVE SHEATHS, AND THEY LOST THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS OF TREES, YOU KNOW, THINGS LIKE THAT.
UM, SO, YOU KNOW, WORTH A COMMUNITY GARDEN LOST THAT TOO.
SO THERE'S E ECOLOGICAL RECOVERY IS GRADUAL.
IT'S KIND OF TRICKY TO MEASURE SOMETIMES, BUT, UM, GOSH, YOU COULD HAVE MORE, I TEACH A CAPSTONE COURSE AT OHIO STATE.
YOU COULD HAVE MORE CAPSTONE STUDENTS DO THEIR RESEARCH PROJECTS TO COME MONITOR VEGETATION IN DUBLIN.
MY WIFE IS A EIGHTH GRADE BIOLOGY TEACHER, SCIENCE TEACHER IN THE WORTHINGTON SYSTEM, AND A YEAR AGO THEY HAD THE EIGHTH GRADERS AND THE FIFTH GRADERS DO THEIR SCIENCE FAIR PROJECTS ALL ABOUT DEER IN WORTHINGTON AND DISPLAY THAT.
AND SO ALL THE, THE YOUTH IN THE COMMUNITY, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD SEE THE AP SCIENCE STUDENTS OR BIOLOGY STUDENTS AT THE DUBLIN HIGH SCHOOLS COULD BE DOING RESEARCH ON, ON MONITORING, YOU KNOW, UM, VEGETATION, THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS THAT YOU CAN DO, BUT IT'S NOT LIKE YOU'RE JUST GONNA SEE SOME OBVIOUS CHANGE.
RIGHT? THIS IS A LONG, LONG-TERM OBSERVATION OF MULTIPLE INDICATORS THAT THE VERY PROCESS OF, WHICH I THINK ACTUALLY IS AN ENGAGEMENT MORE DEEPLY WITH THE LANDSCAPE IN A WAY THAT'S PRETTY POSITIVE.
DEPUTY CHIEF TABER WILL COME TO YOU FOR THIS QUESTION.
WE MODELED THIS PROGRAM AFTER WORTHINGTON'S, AND I KNOW DUBLIN POLICE MET WITH WORTHINGTON POLICE TO LEARN MORE ABOUT THEIR OPERATIONS AND SAFETY MEASURES.
WHAT ARE SOME OF THE THINGS YOU LEARNED FROM THEIR EXPERIENCE? YEAH, THANKS FOR THAT QUESTION, JACKIE.
WE WERE VERY FORTUNATE TO HAVE LEARNED AN AWFUL LOT FROM WORTHINGTON'S EXPERIENCE, UH, NOT THE LEAST OF WHICH WAS FROM THEIR POLICE DEPARTMENT.
I WAS ABLE TO GO TO SEVERAL PUBLIC MEETINGS, MET WITH, UH, SOME OF THEIR COMMAND STAFF, WHO WERE THE ONES THAT OPERATIONALLY HANDLED, UH, ALL THE OPERATIONS IN WORTHINGTON, AND REALLY LEARNED A COUPLE THINGS ALONG THE WAY.
THE VALUE OF HAVING TRAINED PROFESSIONALS LIKE USDA, WHO KNOW WHAT THEY'RE DOING, THEY'RE VERY EXPERIENCED IN DOING IT.
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I KEPT HEARING FROM MY COUNTERPARTS IN WORTHINGTON WAS PROFESSIONALS OR PROFESSIONALISM, AND THE WAY IN WHICH THEY, UH, THE WAY IN WHICH THEY CARRIED OUT THEIR OPERATIONS, THAT GAVE ME AND OUR STAFF AN AWFUL LOT OF CONFIDENCE MOVING FORWARD WITH THIS PROGRAM.THE SECOND THING WAS THE COMMUNICATION.
COMMUNICATION IS GOING TO BE VITAL DURING EVERY PART OF THIS PROGRAM.
SO WE'RE GONNA HAVE DIRECT COMMUNICATION BETWEEN THE POLICE DEPARTMENT AND USDA TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE ARE NO GAPS THERE.
AND THE THIRD THING IS REALLY THE FLEXIBILITY.
UM, EACH SITE, WE'RE GONNA DO A, A SAFETY AUDIT, IF YOU WILL, TO ENSURE THAT THAT SITE IS SAFE, AND WE HAVE TO BE FLEXIBLE TO MOVE WITH THE DEER DEPENDING ON WHERE THEY'RE AT, UM, AND, AND THEIR LIFE PATTERNS.
AND I CAN TELL YOU THAT IF THERE IS A LOCATION THAT FOR SOME REASON THE DUBLIN POLICE DEPARTMENT AND OR USDA THINK IS GOING TO BE UNSAFE, WE WILL JUST NOT CARRY OUT THE OPERATION.
IT'S, IT'S GONNA BE THAT SIMPLE.
SO WE LEARNED ALL THAT FROM WORTHINGTON, UM, AND, AND ARE LOOKING FORWARD TO A SAFE PROGRAM HERE.
JUST TO DOUBLE DOWN ON THAT, UH, DEPUTY CHIEF, CAN YOU ELABORATE, ELABORATE ON THE USDA RELATIONSHIP? SO YOU KNOW, HOW OUR LOCATIONS ARE SCOUTED EACH NIGHT DURING OPERATION, HOW TEAMS COORDINATE THEIR WORK AND HOW THE SURROUNDING AREA IS SECURED.
SO IF WE GET A LITTLE BIT MORE GRANULAR AND, AND OPERATIONAL HERE, THE COMMUNICATION I TALKED ABOUT EARLIER WILL BE VITAL.
SO THAT, UH, WE HAVE OUR OFFICERS LINKED UP DIRECTLY WITH USDA PROFESSIONALS, AND WE'RE GONNA DO THE SITE SPECIFIC, UH, AUDITS.
WE'RE GONNA USE OUR DRONE, SO WE'LL GET SOME AERIAL VIEWS OF THAT, AND THEN BE ABLE TO USE ONE OF THE LOCATIONS THAT THEY DESIGNATED, BE ABLE TO LOOK AT THAT AND SEE IF THERE'S ANYONE THERE.
AND ONCE WE, WE EVALUATE THAT AND FIGURE OUT THAT'S A GOOD LOCATION FOR US, WE'LL BE ABLE TO SHUT OFF, LET'S SAY AN EXAMPLE OF A PARK.
WE'LL BE ABLE TO SHUT THE PARK OFF SO THAT NO ONE CAN COME INTO THAT AREA.
UH, I DO THINK IT'S, IT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO NOTE THAT THIS WILL HAPPEN AT DUSK OR AFTER DUSK.
IT'S PROBABLY GOING TO BE COLD OUT, WHICH SHOULD BE BENEFICIAL.
THERE SHOULDN'T BE, THERE PROBABLY WON'T BE AN AWFUL LOT OF PEOPLE OUT THERE, BUT I WILL REITERATE, IF THERE IS A LOCATION WHERE THERE IS ANY SAFETY CONCERN WHATSOEVER, WE WILL SIMPLY MOVE ALONG AND NOT CONDUCT THE OPERATION.
SUSAN, COMING BACK OVER TO YOU.
WE KNOW SOME RESIDENTS MAY BE CONCERNED ABOUT FIREARMS BEING USED NEAR THEIR NEIGHBORHOODS.
WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO A RESIDENT, SOMEONE WHO LIVES NEARBY ONE OF THE LOCATIONS AND IS WORRIED ABOUT SAFETY? YEAH, THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION.
I MEAN, I WOULD TOTALLY WANT TO ASK ABOUT THAT IF I KNEW THAT THERE WAS A DEER REMOVAL HAPPENING NEAR MY HOME.
AND WE HAD A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT IN WORTHINGTON, ALTHOUGH I WILL JUST SAY WHEN THE OPERATION WAS CARRIED OUT OVER THE LAST WINTER, AND WE REMOVED A HUNDRED DEER IN WORTHINGTON, UH, AND WORTHINGTON USED PRIVATE RESIDENTIAL SITES MORE THAN WE ACTUALLY ENDED UP USING PARKLANDS, PARTLY BECAUSE OF THE COLD WEATHER.
AND THE DEER MOVED OFF THE PARKLANDS INTO PEOPLE'S YARDS.
BUT WE'D HAD 136 PEOPLE SAY, YOU CAN USE MY PROPERTY.
AND OF THOSE, I THINK 30 WERE DEEMED APPROPRIATE.
AND OF THOSE, YOU KNOW, 22 SIGNED A CONTRACT TO SAY, HEY, DO IT.
AND THEN OF THOSE 10 ENDED UP GETTING USED, RIGHT? UM, SO THAT WAS A LOT OF PRIVATE RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES THAT WERE GETTING USED AND OUTTA THAT WHOLE OPERATION WHERE A HUNDRED DEER WERE TAKEN, UH, WORTHINGTON RECEIVED FOUR CALLS FROM PEOPLE WHO HAD HEARD A POPPING NOISE THAT BASED ON THE TIMING OF THAT, WE THINK THOSE WERE ACTUALLY THE SHOTS OF THE DEER REMOVAL THAT WERE HAPPENING.
OTHER THAN THAT, IT WAS, IT, THERE WAS ONE PERSON THAT CAME UP DURING A REMOVAL OPERATION AND TALKED TO A POLICE OFFICER AND HAD SOME QUESTIONS, AND IT WASN'T REALLY A CONCERN.
SO WORTHINGTON DID THIS AND REALLY HAD VERY LITTLE ISSUE.
I MEAN, KEEP IN MIND, METRO PARKS HAS BEEN REMOVING DEER FOR DECADES, AND NO INCIDENTS REALLY.
SO THE PARK LAND THAT DUBLIN IS RELYING ON A LITTLE BIT MORE, I THINK WILL MAKE IT EVEN LESS LIKELY THAT ANYBODY WOULD EVEN NOTICE.
UM, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, HERE'S THE, THE REALLY THE KEY THING THAT I THINK IS SO IMPORTANT IN THINKING ABOUT DEER REMOVAL AND THE SAFETY OF DEER REMOVAL.
WE'VE ALREADY HEARD, YOU KNOW, THE, THE, THE COMMITMENT TO ABSOLUTE COMMITMENT TO SAFETY IN THE FIRST PLACE.
BUT THERE ARE 74 COMMUNITIES IN OHIO THAT HAVE BEEN PART OF A STUDY, AT LEAST THAT WE'RE ASKING, HOW DID THE DEER REMOVAL GO IN YOUR COMMUNITY? SO AT LEAST, YOU KNOW, THIS IS PART OF RESEARCH PROJECT.
UM, AND THOSE 74 COMMUNITIES HAVE 460 YEARS CUMULATIVELY OF EXPERIENCE DOING DEER REMOVAL IN THE STATE OF OHIO.
THERE HAVE BEEN ZERO HUMAN INJURIES IN THOSE 460 YEARS WORTH OF DEER REMOVAL OPERATIONS.
AND THAT'S NOT JUST TARGETED REMOVAL, WHICH IS AS ABOUT AS SAFE AS YOU COULD POSSIBLY IMAGINE.
THAT INCLUDES ARCHERY PROGRAMS WHERE HUNTERS ARE ALLOWED ONTO CERTAIN PROPERTIES TO DO ARCHERY.
AND THERE HAVE BEEN ZERO HUMAN INJURIES, AND THERE HAVE BEEN ZERO, YOU KNOW, ACCIDENTAL
[00:25:01]
PET INJURIES OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.SO, UM, YOU KNOW, THE TAKE HOME MESSAGE IS, GOSH, THERE'S NOTHING TO FEAR HERE IN TERMS OF SAFETY, IN TERMS OF THE TRACK RECORD.
IT'S A STELLAR RECORD OF, OF GOOD SUCCESS.
AND I'LL TAKE IT ONE STEP FURTHER.
I SAW A STUDY, UM, FROM SOME COLLEAGUES AT ODNR THAT WAS DONE SOMETIME RECENTLY OF, OF THE STATISTICAL DANGER OF VARIOUS ACTIVITIES.
AND IT TURNS OUT THAT HUNTING IN GENERAL, NOT TARGETED REMOVAL, AND LIKE THESE CITY PROGRAMS THAT ARE HIGHLY REGULATED AND VERY SPECIALIZED AND JUST EVERYTHING IS ALL ABOUT CITY, JUST HUNTING GENERALLY IS SAFER THAN ALL RECREATIONAL SPORTS.
UM, GOLF APPARENTLY IS MORE DANGEROUS THAN HUNTING.
IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT PEOPLE'S INJURIES.
BILLIARDS IS THE ONE SPORT THAT IS SAFER THAN HUNTING.
APPARENTLY LESS PEOPLE GET HURT, YOU KNOW, SHOOTING POOL THAN HUNTING.
BUT I THINK THAT'S A SHOCKER FOR PEOPLE, RIGHT? I, I'VE BEEN A ROCK CLIMBING INSTRUCTOR FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS, ESPECIALLY IN MY YOUTH, AND, AND MY PARENTS WERE ALWAYS LIKE, YOU'RE ROCK CLIMBING.
AND EVERYBODY'S LIKE, IT'S SO DANGEROUS.
THE MOST DANGEROUS THING ABOUT ROCK CLIMBING IS WHEN YOU'RE DRIVING TO THE PLACE WHERE YOU'RE GONNA ROCK CLIMB THAT WE KNOW THAT STATISTICALLY, RIGHT? SO IT'S, I THINK PEOPLE HAVE ELMER FUDD IN THEIR MIND, YOU KNOW, OR SOMETHING, YOU KNOW, I GREW UP WATCHING CARTOONS AND ELMER FUDD GOES AROUND SHOOTING BULLETS ALL OVER THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
THAT'S A CARTOON, THANK GOODNESS.
YOU KNOW, UM, THAT IS NOT WHAT ANY DEER REMOVAL PROGRAM WOULD EVEN REMOTELY LOOK LIKE.
PEOPLE ARE NOT WANDERING AROUND WITH WEAPONS, JUST SHOOTING THEM ANY WHICH DIRECTION.
SO, UM, YEAH, I THINK THAT'S KEY.
JUST RECOGNIZING HOW INCREDIBLY SAFE THIS IS.
LIKE IF YOU'RE WORRIED ABOUT THE SAFETY OF A DEER REMOVAL PROGRAM, YOU'RE IN MORE DANGER DRIVING HOME FROM THIS MEETING, UH, THAN YOU WILL BE FROM ANY DEER REMOVAL PROGRAM STATISTICALLY.
SO I WILL SAY YOU'LL BE PERFECTLY SAFE DRIVING IN DUBLIN, RIGHT?
WHICH IS, THAT'S SAFE TOO, BUT IT'S, UH, IT'S EVEN SAFER
IT'S NOT TO DO DEER REMOVAL PROGRAM.
UH, BARBARA, THIS ONE IS FOR YOU.
UH, WE KNOW TARGETED REMOVAL IS NOT EXPECTED TO BE A ONE-TIME SOLUTION.
HOW WILL DUBLIN EVALUATE WHETHER THE PROGRAM IS WORKING TO INFORM DECISIONS ABOUT DEER MANAGEMENT IN THE FUTURE YEARS? AGAIN, LOOKING AT THE SOCIAL CARRYING CAPACITY ASPECT, WHICH HAS BEEN A BIG DRIVER IN OUR CITY PARTICULARLY.
UM, AND I NOTICED, UH, BACK IN 2018 WAS WHEN I HAD MY FIRST, UH, COMPLAINT ABOUT DEER STALKING PEOPLE IN THE PARK.
UM, AND THAT WAS VERY CONCERNING BECAUSE IT'S NOT NORMAL FOR A WILD ANIMAL TO BE COMING AFTER A PERSON.
AND OF COURSE, THIS WAS DURING FAWNING SEASON, SO YOU JUST ASSUME THAT THERE'S A BABY NEARBY, AND A DOG WALKER OR A BIKE RIDER IS A LITTLE BIT, YOU KNOW, FEELING THREATENING TO THE MO MOTHER.
UM, HOWEVER, THIS HAS EXPANDED TO, UM, I THINK FIVE OR SIX SEVEN PARK AREAS AND NEIGHBORHOODS.
THESE DEER ARE HAVING MULTIPLE BABIES.
THEY'RE NOT JUST HAVING ONE FAWN, RIGHT? 'CAUSE THEY HAVE THIS SMORGASBORD, THEIR FEN VERY HIGH IN THE CITY AND URBAN AREAS, AND THEY'RE TRAINING THEIR BABIES HOW TO RESPOND.
AND SO THESE YOUNG DOS ARE LEARNING THE SAME BEHAVIOR FROM THEIR MOTHER.
AND THIS HAS JUST EXPANDED EXPONENTIALLY THROUGH THE CITY.
AND WE'VE HAD, UM, AT LEAST ONE PERSON BADLY INJURED AND SPENT TIME IN THE HOSPITAL LAST YEAR, UH, BROKEN COLLARBONE, BROKEN ELBOW, AND JUST BEATEN UP BECAUSE, DEAR, WHEN THEY DO ATTACK, THEY ARE GOING TO STRIKE YOU WITH THEIR FRONT FEET AND THEY'RE GONNA KNOCK YOU DOWN AND JUST POUND, POUND, POUND, POUND.
AND THEY DO THE SAME THING TO A DOG OR A CAT OR ANY OTHER ANIMAL THAT THEY SEE AS THREATENING.
UM, WE'VE HAD LOTS OF OUR RESIDENTS WITH CHILDREN KIND OF GET CORNERED AND THEY'LL, THEY'LL BE ON THE PARK PATH, BUT THEN THEY RUN UP TO SOMEONE'S RANDOM HOUSE ON THEIR PATIO, AND DEER WILL HOLD THEM AT BAY THERE FOR 30 OR 40 MINUTES BEFORE THE PERSON CAN ACTUALLY LEAVE THAT, UM, THAT AREA.
SO THOSE ARE BEHAVIORS THAT ARE VERY DISTRESSING TO ME.
I'VE BEEN DOING WILDLIFE REHABILITATION FOR 40 YEARS.
I RESCUE ANIMALS AND SAVE THEM.
SO IT'S VERY DISTRESSING TO SEE THESE WILD ANIMALS LEARNING THESE KIND OF BEHAVIORS OF GOING AFTER PEOPLE NOW.
AND WE DID HAVE AN INCIDENT THIS SUMMER WHERE SOME OF OUR STAFF WAS REMOVING A STUMP NEAR ONE OF THE BIKE PATHS, AND A DO CAME TOWARD THEM.
WE HAVE THE BIG WHITE WORK TRUCKS YOU SEE ALL OVER THE CITY.
THEY WENT AND KIND OF HID BEHIND THEIR TRUCK, AND THE DEER ATTACKED THE TRUCK.
AND I THOUGHT, HOW CRAZY IS THIS THAT THE DEER ARE, YOU KNOW, GONNA GO AFTER AN INANIMATE OBJECT? UM, AND SHE, SHE PROBABLY DID HAVE A FAWN NEARBY, AND WE DO TONS OF EDUCATION FOR THE PUBLIC ABOUT THAT.
BUT ANYWAY, IT'S GOING TO TAKE SEVERAL MORE YEARS THEN TO KIND OF UNTRAIN THESE DEER GENERATIONALLY HOW TO RESPOND THAT WAY.
[00:30:01]
MIGHT BE SOME, UH, HAZING PRESSURE ON THE DEER, RIGHT? THEY, THEY DON'T SEE US AS ANY KIND OF THREAT, WHEREAS AN ONGOING, UH, REMOVAL PROGRAM, THEY MAY FINALLY GET THE HINT THAT, HEY, WE NEED TO KIND OF AVOID HUMANS.AND THEN THERE MIGHT BE A LOT LESS OF THIS, UH, KIND OF LET'S APPROACH A PERSON DIRECTLY BEHAVIOR.
USUALLY, UH, MOST OF THE CITIES, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THESE 74, 75 CITIES IN OHIO THAT HAVE BEEN DOING DEER REMOVAL, UM, THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT USUALLY THREE TO FIVE YEARS BEFORE THERE'S A BIG CHANGE THAT'S NOTICED IN SOME OF THEIR BEHAVIOR, UH, LESS LANDSCAPE DAMAGE AND THOSE KINDS OF THINGS.
AND WE'RE GONNA, UM, DIRECT THIS ONE TO EITHER OR YOU OR GREG, IF YOU GUYS WANNA TAG TEAM THIS.
UM, WE'VE TALKED ABOUT IT A LITTLE BIT ALREADY TONIGHT, BUT BEYOND THE NUMBER OF DEER, WHAT OTHER CHANGES WOULD INDICATE THAT THE PROGRAM IS WORKING, FOR EXAMPLE, FEWER CRASHES OR FEWER CONFLICTS BETWEEN RESIDENTS AND DEER? I'LL JUST SAY, I KNOW THAT SOME OF THE THINGS THAT I KNOW WORTHINGTON IS COUNTING.
SO THE POLICE FORCE, YOU KNOW, ONE OF OUR MEASURES OF DEER POPULATIONS IS THE GUYS THAT RUN THE NIGHT SHIFT, THEY DRIVE AROUND, AND THAT'S WHAT THEY DO ANYWAY.
THEY SPOTLIGHT DEER, LIKE, LOOK AT THAT ONE.
YOU KNOW, AND THEY, SO THEY ACTUALLY COUNT THAT OFFICIAL COUNTS ON CERTAIN DAYS.
THEY KIND OF SET UP A PROCEDURE.
WELL, THAT IS AN INDEX OF HOW MANY DEER WERE OUT THAT PARTICULAR NIGHT ON THE ROUTE THAT THEY TYPICALLY TAKE, HOW MANY DEER THEY SEE.
AND IF THEY DO THAT AT SIMILAR TIMES ON REGULAR OCCURRENCES, THEY GET SOME MEASURE OF WHETHER THOSE NUMBERS ARE CHANGING.
UM, SO THESE INDEXES, AS WE CALL 'EM, AGAIN, I THINK AS MITCH ORIGINALLY SAID, IT'S NOT LIKE YOU EVER GET A FULL COUNT OF HOW MANY DEER ARE IN DUBLIN.
UM, BUT YOU DO GET A SNAPSHOT AT ONE POINT.
AND IF YOU DO THE, IF YOU DO YOUR SNAPSHOT REPEATEDLY AT SIMILAR TIMES IN SIMILAR CONDITIONS, AND, AND WHAT WE KIND OF HOPE TO SEE IS THAT THAT NUMBER STARTS TO TREND DOWNWARD, RIGHT? SO SAME THING WITH ALL THESE OTHER THINGS, RIGHT? THAT ALL, HOPEFULLY ALL THE NUMBERS OF THE CONCERNING, YOU KNOW, THE AGGRESSIVE DEER BEHAVIOR, THE DEER CARCASS PICKUPS, ALL THOSE KINDS OF THINGS, WE HOPE TO SEE ALL THOSE NUMBERS SORT OF TREND DOWN.
NO ONE NUMBER IS GONNA BE THE DECIDER, UH, BECAUSE THINGS CAN REALLY VARY.
AND, YOU KNOW, THERE MAY BE JUST NATURAL VARIATION THAT MAYBE NEXT YEAR'S A BOOM YEAR FOR DEER FOR SOME CLIMATOLOGICAL REASON OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
BUT OVER THREE TO FIVE YEARS, YOU LOOK AT ALL THOSE TRENDS AND HOPE TO SEE A NUMBER OF THOSE TREND LINES GOING DOWN, AND YOU RESPOND ACCORDINGLY IN TERMS OF YOUR MANAGEMENT.
IT MIGHT BE WORTH MENTIONING FOR, FOR THOSE OF YOU THAT HAVE BEEN HERE IN THE CITY A LONG TIME, YOU KNOW THAT THERE USED TO BE A, A CANADA GOOSE ISSUE,
AND TO THE POINT WHERE WHEN I WAS WORKING, UH, FOR DR. BURTON AT THE WILDLIFE CENTER HOSPITAL, UH, THE CITY OF DUBLIN CAME TO US AND SAID, HEY, WHAT CAN WE DO ABOUT ALL THESE, THESE GEESE? AND CAN YOU RUN A DOG OR SOMETHING IN THE CITY? AND WHAT WE DID WAS RECOMMEND THAT THE CITY CREATE SOME BUFFER ZONES AROUND THE PONDS.
AND YES, WE COULD RUN THE DOGS, BUT THE NUMBER ONE CHANGE TO GET GEESE TO NOT COLLECT IN SUCH HIGH NUMBERS WAS TO STOP FEEDING THEM.
AND SO THE CITY PASSED A NO FEED ORDINANCE FOR THE GEESE AND, AND DUCKS, I THINK IN 2004 OR THEREABOUTS.
AND WE WENT FROM REPORTING, I THINK 75 NESTS WERE ADDLED IN THE CITY ON A REGULAR BASIS WHEN MIMI GLORY WAS HERE.
UM, AND I HAVE REPORTED IN THE LAST 10 YEARS THAT I'VE BEEN HERE, I'VE REPORTED THREE TO SIX NESTS MAXIMUM, UM, USUALLY AROUND THREE
SO WE'RE, WE REALLY HAVE CONTROLLED THAT PROBLEM WITH THE NO FEED.
AND THAT'S GONNA BE ANOTHER HUGE COMPONENT TO SEEING THIS CHANGE IN OUR DEER.
AND INSTEAD OF HAVING 15 OR 20 DEER COMING THROUGH SOME OF THESE YARDS AND, AND DOING ALL THIS DESTRUCTION, AND QUITE HONESTLY, PEOPLE THAT HAVE CHILDREN AND GRANDCHILDREN, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE NOT LETTING THEIR KIDS OUT WHEN THERE'S 10 OR 15 DEER IN THE YARD.
UM, HOPEFULLY WE'LL SEE A LITTLE CHANGE IN THOSE NUMBERS.
GETTING PEOPLE TO STOP FEEDING THE DEER WILL, UH, YOU KNOW, DECREASE THE NUMBER THAT ARE WANTING TO TRAVEL THROUGH THAT PARTICULAR CONCENTRATED SPOT.
AND IT WILL MAKE HAZING A LOT EASIER IF WE ACTUALLY DO NEED TO GO OUT AND, YOU KNOW, GET A DEER TO SCARE OFF.
WE MIGHT ACTUALLY BE ABLE TO ACCOMPLISH THAT.
WE WILL NOW OPEN UP FOR QUESTIONS.
SO MARIE AND JONATHAN WILL BE AROUND TO COLLECT YOUR COMMENT CARDS AND READ OFF YOUR QUESTIONS.
SO, LIKE WE DID AT THE LAST MEETING, WOULD YOU RAISE YOUR HAND IF YOU ATTENDED THE LAST PUBLIC MEETING ABOUT THE DEER MANAGEMENT PROGRAM? OKAY.
SO, UM, WHAT A TROOPER TO COME BACK AGAIN.
HOPEFULLY YOU'VE LEARNED ANOTHER NEW NUGGET TO SHARE EVERY TIME,
WELL, SO JONATHAN'S OVER THERE, AND WHEN YOU CAME IN, YOU HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO PICK UP A FORM LIKE THIS.
AND WHAT WE WANT YOU TO DO IS TO WRITE DOWN YOUR COMMENT
[00:35:01]
OR YOUR QUESTION, AND IF YOU NEED SOMETHING TO WRITE ON, I DO HAVE ONE CLIPBOARD HERE TO, UM, IF YOU NEED SOMETHING, A LITTLE BACKING.AND WHAT THAT WILL DO IS, NUMBER ONE, HELPS YOU KIND OF GET YOUR THOUGHTS IN ORDER.
NUMBER TWO, IT GIVES THE TEAM CONCRETE DOCUMENTATION OF YOUR INPUT.
AND THEN WHAT THE TEAM DOES IS THEY KEEP UPDATING THE FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS ONLINE BASED ON WHAT YOU HAVE TO SAY.
THE OTHER THING, IF FOR SOME REASON YOU WOULD REALLY LIKE TO MAKE SURE YOU HAVE SOMEBODY CONTACT YOU LATER, JUST PUT YOUR EMAIL ADDRESS ON HERE AS WELL, AND WE'LL GET BACK TO YOU.
SO DOES ANYBODY HAVE A QUESTION OR COMMENT? I HAVE ONE WRITTEN, I HAVE ONE FOR US TO START.
UM, ONE QUESTION HERE IS ABOUT, UM, WHAT ARE WE DOING ABOUT DEFORESTATION? IT BEING ONE OF THOSE CAUSES OF DEER POPULATION AND CITY LIMITS.
OUR, UH, PARKS AND FORESTRY HORTICULTURE TEAMS HAVE WORKED REALLY HARD TO TRY TO REBUILD SOME OF OUR, OUR NATIVE HABITAT AREAS.
AND I, I HAD A FAVORITE TREE IN INDIAN RUN FALLS, A LITTLE YOUNG, UH, KENTUCKY COFFEE TREE.
AND THE PARKS, UH, HORTICULTURE TEAM DID EVERYTHING THEY COULD TO PROTECT THIS TREE.
IT WAS A LITTLE TALLER THAN ME.
UM, AND IT TOOK ABOUT THREE YEARS, BUT THE DEER FIGURED OUT HOW TO DESTROY THAT TREE.
BUT ANYWAY, UM, WE HAVE A LOT OF PARK SPACE WHERE, YOU KNOW, WE MIGHT NOT TRY TO REFOREST IT BECAUSE THE PUBLIC IS SO CONCENTRATED THERE, BUT WE HAVE A LOT MORE SPACE THAT WE CAN REPLANT AND HAVE REPLANTED.
AND TRYING TO GET SOME OF THAT GROWTH TO COME BACK IS REALLY, REALLY DIFFICULT BECAUSE OF THE WILDLIFE.
UM, MOSTLY DEER EATING THAT STUFF BACK DOWN.
OUR WOODCHUCKS, OUR RABBITS, OUR FOREST EDGE ANIMALS, THEY'RE MORE LIKELY TO DAMAGE PLANTS OR REPLANTINGS ON THE EDGES OF THOSE, UH, FORESTED AREAS.
UH, WHEREAS THE DEER ARE GOING RIGHT IN THE WOODS AND EATING THOSE THINGS DOWN ABOUT AS FAST AS WE CAN PLANT THEM.
UH, WE STILL, ON EARTH DAY, WE'LL HAVE PUBLIC PROGRAMS WHERE WE'LL BRING, UH, VOLUNTEERS IN AND WE'LL DO, I THINK WE PLANTED 2000 PLANTS AT KAUFFMAN PARK A FEW YEARS BACK, UM, WITH 50 OR 60 VOLUNTEERS THAT CAME FROM OUR RESIDENTS, UH, THAT SIGNED UP TO DO THAT.
SO WE DO HAVE PROJECTS LIKE THAT ONGOINGS THROUGHOUT THE CITY, AND WE FOCUS A LOT ON POLLINATOR MEADOWS AND, UM, OUR BUFFER ZONES AROUND OUR PONDS, BECAUSE THOSE ARE AREAS WHERE THE DEER AREN'T AS LIKELY TO DESTROY EVERYTHING.
FORESTATION WHAT DO YOU MEAN? I'M SORRY.
ANYTHING TO STOP CUTTING THE TREES OR ANY THAT STUFF? ARE THERE ANY ZONES THAT WE'RE LABELING, LIKE, HEY, WE'RE GONNA MEET THIS AS WILDLIFE ZONE, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, ESPECIALLY WITH THAT BIG PRODUCT.
THAT'S BARBARA, WOULD YOU REPEAT THE QUESTION? I THINK SHE'S ASKING ABOUT DEFORESTATION SPECIFICALLY.
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT MORE LIKE DEVELOPMENT AREAS.
ARE WE DOING ANYTHING ABOUT, AND WE'VE TALKING ABOUT LIKE REFORESTING THE PARTS THAT ARE, THAT I'M ASKING, LIKE, ARE WE DOING ANYTHING ABOUT HINDERING OR DEFORESTING, LIKE SLOWING DOWN DEFORESTATION, OR, I SEE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING ABOUT THAT.
YEAH, THAT'S GONNA BE PROBABLY A QUESTION FOR, UH, ANOTHER PROJECT THAT'S GOING ON BECAUSE YES, WE HAVE A PERCENTAGE OF OF LAND THAT HAS TO BE MAINTAINED AS GREEN SPACE, AND WE CERTAINLY MAINTAIN AS MUCH NATURAL HABITAT AS WE CAN IN THOSE AREAS, BUT THAT'S REALLY NOT NECESSARILY SOMETHING I COULD ANSWER TONIGHT FOR YOU.
I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING, IF YOU'D LIKE TO REACH OUT TO ME OR TALK TO ME AFTERWARD, I'D BE HAPPY TO GO INTO THE DEVELOPMENT RELATED INFORMATION.
SO HOW WILL YOU MAKE SURE, WELL, LET ME REPHRASE THIS.
WILL FAWNS BE HARVESTED OR ONLY MATURE DEER WITHOUT BABIES? IN THE PAST? THE PROGRAMS I'VE BEEN FAMILIAR WITH THAT, UH, OTHER CITIES HAVE BEEN DOING, HAVE JUST BEEN HARVESTING ADULT DEER AND ACTUALLY IN THE FALL, SO THERE MIGHT BE SOME FAWNS IN THAT, UM, GROUPING, BECAUSE OUR FAWNS ARE NOW 75 POUNDS OR MORE.
SO THEY'RE, THEY'RE ALMOST THE SIZE OF AN ADULT DEER BY THE FALL AND WINTER.
UH, MOST OF THEM HAVE LOST THEIR SPOTS BY JANUARY.
SO IT'S REALLY ALMOST INDISTINGUISHABLE UNLESS YOU'RE REALLY LOOKING AT, UM, SIZE.
BUT YEAH, SO IT'S NOT, THERE'S NO BABY DEER THAT ARE GOING TO BE TAKEN AS PART OF THE PROJECT.
UM, WE'VE GOT A FEW QUESTIONS HERE.
HAS THE CITY CONSIDERED MODIFYING FENCING STANDARDS TO DISCOURAGE DEER IN, UH, RE RESIDENTIAL YARDS?
[00:40:03]
AGAIN, I THINK THAT'S GONNA BE A QUESTION FOR HOAS.UM, I DO RECOMMEND FOR SOME RESIDENTS WHO ARE HAVING A VERY SPECIFIC ISOLATED PROBLEM TO GO AHEAD AND PUT UP A LITTLE BARRIER FENCE AROUND A GARDEN OR LANDSCAPE AREA TEMPORARILY.
IN MOST CASES, THEIR NEIGHBORS DON'T CARE ABOUT THAT.
IT'S ONLY UP THERE FOR A FEW WEEKS.
UM, BUT IT PROBABLY DOES VIOLATE SOME SPECIFIC HOA RULES IN SOME NEIGHBORHOODS.
SO IT'S KIND OF UP TO THE HOMEOWNER, WHETHER THAT'S SOMETHING THEY THINK THEY CAN DO, BUT IT IS, UH, A, A TEMPORARY METHOD TO RETRAIN WILDLIFE TO DIVERT FROM THAT PARTICULAR GARDEN.
SO I'M NOT REALLY IN THE HABIT OF RECOMMENDING ILLEGAL THINGS, BUT AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW EVERYBODY'S HOA RULES, AND WE DO HAVE A LOT OF AREAS IN THE CITY WHERE PEOPLE CAN PUT UP THOSE KINDS OF TEMPORARY FENCING JUST FINE.
UM, SO I THINK AS FAR AS CHANGING RULES THAT, UH, AS FAR AS I UNDERSTAND IT WOULD GO MORE THROUGH INDIVIDUAL NEIGHBORHOOD HOA, UH, ASSOCIATIONS.
SO I THINK GREG AND BARBARA, THIS MIGHT BE FOR ONE OF YOU, WHAT DISEASES DO DEER POPULATIONS HAVE THAT CAN IMPACT HUMANS? GO AHEAD.
YEAH, WE DON'T HAVE, UH, REALLY DISEASES THAT THE DEER ARE GOING TO GIVE TO US OR OUR PETS.
UM, LYME DISEASE IS ALWAYS A CONCERN FOR PEOPLE, BUT HERE'S SOMETHING ABOUT LYME DISEASE.
DEER CARRY AN ENZYME IN THEIR BLOOD THAT ACTUALLY KILLS LYME BACTERIA.
SO IF A TICK IN ONE OF ITS THREE INSTAR STAGES BITES A DEER AND FEEDS FROM IT, UM, IF IT HAD LYME, IT NO LONGER HAS IT.
SO THEY'RE KIND OF DOING US A SERVICE
ON THE FLIP SIDE, A LOT OF DEER CAN SUPPORT A LOT MORE TICKS, AND THAT HAS, UM, BEEN AN ISSUE FOR SOME, SOME CITIES IN OHIO THAT HAVE, UH, STARTED MANAGEMENT PROGRAMS JUST TO REDUCE DEER NUMBERS AND REDUCE DISEASE.
SOME OF THE OTHER THINGS WE MIGHT SEE, I KNOW WE'VE HAD, UM, UH, SOME OF THE WARDEE DISEASES IN DUBLIN.
YOU'VE SEEN SOME DEER MAYBE THAT HAVE THESE WEIRD LITTLE, UM, GROWTHS ON THEIR HEAD.
UM, THAT'S A, A KIND OF, UH, BACTERIA THAT, OR VIRUS THAT JUST AFFECTS DEER.
IT DOESN'T REALLY AFFECT ANYTHING ELSE.
UM, CWD AND EHD ARE NOT PARTICULARLY IN CENTRAL OHIO SPECIFICALLY, AND THOSE STAND FOR DEER WASTING DISEASE OR YEAH, CHRONIC WASTING DISEASE AND, UH, EPIZOOTIC HEMORRHAGIC DISEASE.
SO THE HD IS GONNA BE SEEN MORE WHERE THERE'S, UM, IN SOUTHERN HALF OF THE STATE, UM, THERE'S THAT SPREAD BY MIDGES FLYING MIDGES THAT BITE THE DEER.
CHRONIC WASTING DISEASE IS NOW IN, UH, MARION WYON DOT HARDIN.
I DON'T, THEY MAY HAVE ADDED UNION COUNTY OR PARTS OF NORTH UNION COUNTY TO THAT, UH, I'M MISSING ANOTHER COUNTY, BUT SO FAR IT'S BEEN ISOLATED IN THE WILD IN THOSE, THOSE COUNTIES.
JONATHAN, I'VE GOT 'EM STACKED UP, BUT YOU'RE, YOU'RE NEXT.
OKAY, LET ME, LET ME, LET ME ADD JUST ONE THING.
BACK TO THE NO FEEDING ORDINANCE.
UH, THERE HAVE BEEN STUDIES DONE ON WHEN DO DEER, YOU KNOW, SPREAD DISEASE AMONGST THEMSELVES, AND IF PEOPLE ARE FEEDING DEER, YOU HAVE A PILE OF CORN OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, THEN THE DEER COME UP, THEY TOUCH NOSES, AND THEY'VE ACTUALLY STUDIED THAT VERY CLOSELY TO SEE WHAT THE INCIDENCE OF DISEASE TRANSMISSION IS IN PLACES WHERE THAT'S GOING ON VERSUS EVEN JUST DISPERSED FOOD PLOTS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
AND, UM, THAT'S A SIGNIFICANT ISSUE WITH FEEDING DEER IS THE CHANCES OF SPREADING DISEASE ARE HIGHER.
SO THAT'S WORTH THINKING ABOUT TOO.
SO THIS QUESTION'S ABOUT THE DATA THAT LED US TO THIS.
SO, UM, THIS PERSON SAYS, GIVEN OD NR DATA AND COLLISION DATA, DO NOT SUPPORT, UH, THIS PROGRAM OR A CALLING.
IS THERE DATA THAT DOES, AND WHAT DATA MIGHT HAVE LED US HERE TODAY? I'LL, I'LL JUMP ON THAT JUST TO SAY, I, I DON'T THINK IT'S TRUE THAT THE COLLISION DATA DON'T SUPPORT, UH, DEER MANAGEMENT.
I, BUT AS WE'VE SAID, I THINK IN A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT WAYS, DEER VEHICLE COLLISIONS AREN'T REALLY THE DRIVER IN DUBLIN, AND THEY DEFINITELY WEREN'T IN WORTHINGTON, THEY'RE ONE OF THE NUMBERS YOU WOULD LOOK AT AND YOU WOULD HOPE THE NUMBER WOULD GO DOWN.
BUT IT'S NOT LIKE A DEER VEHICLE COLLISION CRISIS THAT HAS LED TO WANTING TO REDUCE DEER NUMBERS.
UM, SO I, YOU KNOW, I THINK THE FOCUSING MAINLY ON DEER VEHICLE COLLISIONS AS SOMEHOW THE DECIDER ABOUT WHETHER WE SHOULD DO ANYTHING ABOUT DEER IN DUBLIN DOESN'T, DOESN'T REALLY MAKE SENSE.
THAT'S NOT HOW THE DECISION'S BEING MADE, NOR IS THAT HOW THE DECISION GETS MADE FOR DEER MANAGEMENT ACROSS THE STATE IN MANY DIFFERENT, YOU KNOW, DIFFERENT VARIABLES WE TALKED ABOUT.
WHAT WE'RE SEEING IS MAYBE THE END RESULT THAT HAS INCREASED SIGNIFICANTLY IN, UH, SINCE ABOUT 2011, UH,
[00:45:01]
WHERE WE'RE PICKING UP OVER A HUNDRED DEER CARCASSES A YEAR, AND MOST OF THOSE ARE DEER STRIKE VICTIMS, THE DEER.SO I, I'VE BEEN IN COLLISIONS WITH 14 DEER OVER MY LIFETIME.
UM, MOST OF THEM HAVE HIT ME, BUT I'VE HIT A COUPLE OF 'EM AND I DRIVE VERY SLOW AT NIGHT IN MY RURAL AREA WHERE I LIVE, AND I STILL HAVE HAD THOSE ACCIDENTS.
BUT, UM, MOST, A LOT OF THOSE DEER, YOU KNOW, THEY MIGHT GET A BROKEN LEG OR SOMETHING AND JUST RUN OFF.
SO WE'RE PICKING UP DEER IN AREAS THAT AREN'T NECESSARILY RIGHT ON THE ROAD, BUT THEY'VE RUN OFF AND THEY'VE DIED LATER IN SOMEONE'S YARD OR IN THE WOODS.
UM, BUT THEY'RE CLEARLY WERE STRUCK BY A CAR.
AND MAYBE SOMEONE JUST DIDN'T REPORT THAT.
I KNOW I ONLY CALLED THE POLICE ON A COUPLE OF MY COLLISIONS FOR INSURANCE PURPOSES.
THE REST OF THEM I JUST DROVE ON AND GOT A LITTLE DENT IN MY CAR,
SO I THINK WE HAVE A LOT MORE COLLISIONS THAN WHAT IS RECORDED WITH THE POLICE DEPARTMENT, IS WHAT I'M TRYING TO SAY.
MITCH, THIS MIGHT BE ONE FOR YOU, BARBARA.
CAN I RESPOND TO MY QUESTION? UM, WE HAVE QUICK FOLLOW UP, JUST A QUICK FOLLOW UP.
WE, WE, WE CAN TAKE A QUICK FOLLOW UP.
HERE, DO YOU WANNA TAKE THE MIC? I'LL, I'LL TALK LOUD ENOUGH SO THAT YOU GUYS CAN HEAR ME.
UM, BUT IF DEER COLLISIONS AREN'T LIKE A MAJOR POINT OF CONTENTION FOR THE DEER PROGRAM, THEY'RE ONE OF THREE THINGS LISTED ON WHY THE DEER NEED TO BE REMOVED.
YOU HAVE ECOLOGICAL DAMAGE, DEER HEALTH, AND THEN YOU HAVE DEER COLLISIONS, RIGHT? AND THE DEER COLLISION DATA, I CAN READ IT DIRECTLY FROM YOUR GUYS' SITE, IS DEER, DEER VEHICLE COLLISION DATA SHOWS YOUR DEER VARIABILITY, BUT NO SUSTAINED UPWARD TREND.
RECENT YEARS HAVE GENERALLY REFLECTED LOW NUMBERS OF COLLISIONS AND LOW INJURY SEVERITY, AND YOU CAN READ ON, BUT IN THE LAST TWO YEARS, YOU HAVEN'T HAD EVEN ONE INJURY, NOT A SERIOUS INJURY.
UM, BUT THEN AS FAR AS DEER HEALTH GOES, UM, THE OD R DATA SAYS THE SAME THING.
DEER HEALTH IS NORMAL AND HEALTHY.
SO IS THERE ANY OTHER DATA THAT DOES SUPPORT A CALLING PROGRAM? YEAH, I'LL, I'LL JUMP IN ON THAT.
SO, UH, YOU KNOW, UH, BACK TO THE COLLISION DATA, UM, THE, AGAIN, THE MAIN CONCERN ISN'T, YOU KNOW, WHETHER WE HAVE THIS INCREASING NUMBER.
THE SURVEYS THAT WE DID, PARTICULARLY IN WORTHINGTON, I CAN TELL YOU MORE SPECIFICALLY AS WE SAID DEER VEHICLE COLLISIONS WEREN'T A DRIVING CONCERN FOR THAT PROGRAM.
AND IT, IT MAY BE SIMILAR HERE TOO, BUT WHEN WE ASKED RESIDENTS, WHAT ARE YOU CONCERNED ABOUT, THE NUMBER ONE CONCERN WAS DEER VEHICLE COLLISIONS.
SO IT IS A VALID CONCERN THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE THAT THEY'RE WORRIED ABOUT.
WE HAD A LOT OF PEOPLE WRITE IN ON THE SURVEY IN THE OPEN-ENDED QUESTIONS, THEY SAID THINGS LIKE, I KNOW AND NOBODY'S GOTTEN KILLED YET BY HITTING A DEER, BUT IT'S JUST A MATTER OF TIME.
I CAN'T IMAGINE IF ONE OF OUR KIDS STEPPED OUT, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING LIKE THIS, RIGHT? OR IF MY DAUGHTER WAS DRIVING HOME AND WAS THE FIRST PERSON TO HIT A DEER AND GET KILLED.
SO IT'S NOT THE DRIVER, BUT IT IS A VERY RELEVANT CONCERN THAT PEOPLE HAVE AND PEOPLE THINK, LOOK, THE WAY THE NUMBERS ARE, IF WE DON'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT THIS, WE RUN THE RISK OF HAVING THESE WORST THINGS HAPPEN BECAUSE WE DIDN'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT.
SO THAT'S, I THINK, WHERE THE, THE CONCERN LEVEL AROUND DEER VEHICLE COLLISIONS IS STILL RELEVANT.
IT MATTERS A LOT TO PEOPLE, EVEN IF IT ISN'T KIND OF THE NUMBER ONE THING THAT YOU'D SAY, OH MY GOSH, WE REALLY GOTTA TAKE ACTION BECAUSE THERE'S SO MANY DEER GETTING HIT BY CARS.
THAT'S JUST NOT HAPPENING AS MUCH IN PLACES LIKE WORTHINGTON IN DUBLIN.
SO PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE DATA IS NOT REALLY REASON, IS THERE ANY DATA THAT'S BEEN COLLECTED? EVIDENCE THAT DOES SUPPORT, YEAH.
WELL, SO, AND I'LL JUMP ON THAT TOO IF YEAH.
AND THEN WE'RE GONNA MOVE ON TO OTHER PEOPLE.
AND FROM MARIE, WE DISCUSS DATA.
SO LEMME GIVE YOU, SO STANDBY, AND HE'S GONNA GIVE YOU SOME DATA.
I'LL GIVE YOU A COUPLE, AND I'M HAPPY TO STICK AROUND AFTERWARDS AND TALK A LOT MORE, SORT OF MORE EXTENSIVELY.
BUT FOR INSTANCE, IN THE SURVEYS THAT WE'VE GIVEN, THE, THE SURVEY THAT WAS GIVEN TO THE DUBLIN COMMUNITY WAS MODELED OFF THE ONE THAT WE GAVE TO THE WORTHING COMMUNITY AND THE WORDING COMMUNITY.
WE ASKED A FEW ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS.
YOU KNOW, USUALLY YOU DON'T WANT TO HAVE A REALLY LONG SURVEY, OTHERWISE PEOPLE AREN'T GONNA TAKE THE TIME TO ANSWER IT.
AND I THINK THE DUBLIN ONE WAS A LITTLE MORE EFFICIENT THAN THE WORTHINGTON ONE, BUT WE REALLY DRILLED DOWN IN WORTHINGTON TO FIND OUT A LOT OF THINGS, YOU KNOW, ABOUT WHAT KIND OF CONCERNS PEOPLE HAVE AND WHAT'S THE DATA THAT WOULD SAY WE SHOULD DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS.
PART OF THE DATA WAS SIMPLY THAT PEOPLE HAVE SO MANY COMPLAINTS AND WOULD LIKE TO SEE DEER NUMBERS GO DOWN.
THERE'S A MAJORITY OF PEOPLE SAYING THAT, WELL, THAT'S RELEVANT, BUT NOT GONNA DRIVE THE WHOLE THING, ESPECIALLY IF THERE'S NOTHING ELSE TO BASE IT ON, RIGHT? THE OTHER THING WAS PROPERTY DAMAGE, RIGHT? ALL THESE GARDENERS AND PEOPLE SAYING, YOU KNOW, AND AS A, YOU KNOW, TREE REGENERATION, THOSE KIND OF THINGS, WELL, THAT COSTS MONEY.
WELL, HOW MUCH MONEY DOES THAT COST? SO WE HAD A QUESTION THAT SAID, WELL, HOW MUCH DO YOU SUSPECT YOU'VE SPENT ON REPLACING PLANTS, BUILDING FENCES, UH, REPAIRING STUFF ON YOUR HOME OR OTHER DAMAGE? AND THAT NUMBER FOR THE 4,000 PEOPLE THAT TOOK THE SURVEY IN WORTHINGTON ADDED UP TO A $1.5 MILLION OVER THE LAST THREE YEARS.
SO WE'VE SEEN WORTHINGTON RESIDENTS HAVING TO PAY OUT
[00:50:01]
OF $1.5 MILLION JUST FOR THE PEOPLE THAT TOOK THE SURVEY OF PROPERTY DAMAGE THAT'S COMING FROM THE EXCESS NUMBER OF DEER.WE ALSO ASKED, HAVE YOU HAD ANY MEDICAL BILLS OR VETERINARY BILLS THAT HAVE COME FROM NEGATIVE INTERACTIONS WITH DEER? EITHER ARE DEER VEHICLE COLLISION, OR FROM YOUR PET BEING ATTACKED BY A DEER? AND THE AMOUNT THAT WAS TALLIED FROM THE PEOPLE WHO'VE HAD THOSE EXPENSES WAS A QUARTER OF A MILLION DOLLARS THAT WORTHINGTON RESIDENTS IN THE LAST THREE YEARS HAVE HAD TO PAY FOR MEDICAL EXPENSES BECAUSE OF CONFLICT WITH FEAR.
ALL OF THOSE ARE REALLY IMPORTANT DATA POINTS OF, OF, AGAIN, SOCIAL CARING CAPACITY, SOCIAL TOLERANCE, HITTING A LEVEL THAT SAYS, YOU KNOW, WE SHOULD REALLY DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS.
ALL RIGHT, WE'RE NOT GONNA CONTINUE THE DIALOGUE, SIR.
YOU CAN TALK TO GREG AFTERWARDS.
THERE ARE 30 OTHER PEOPLE IN THE ROOM THAT HAVE QUESTIONS THAT I'M GONNA MOVE ON TO THE NEXT ONE.
SO YOU ARE WELCOME TO GO ONLINE.
THERE'S A QR CODE RIGHT HERE THAT HAS EVERY FACT ON THERE THAT IS AVAILABLE.
SIR, THE GROUND RULES ARE YOU'RE GONNA BE RESPECTFUL AND POLITE.
IF YOU CAN'T FOLLOW THE GROUND RULES, WE'LL ASK YOU TO LEAVE.
SO RUMOR HAS IT THAT THE FOOD PANTRY DOES NOT WANT VENISON.
SO, AND I'M LOOKING AT YOU, MITCH, BECAUSE YOU MAY BE THE ONE TALKING TO THE FOOD PANTRY, I'M NOT SURE.
BUT, UM, DO YOU, HAVEN'T YOU HAD POSITIVE CONVERSATIONS WITH THE PO FOOD PANTRY? AND WHAT IS THAT RELATIONSHIP? AND IF THAT DOESN'T WORK OUT, IS THERE ANOTHER ALTERNATIVE? SO I GUESS I'LL ANSWER IT PRETTY BRIEFLY.
UM, THE, THE PLAN FOR THIS PROGRAM, SINCE INITIAL CONVERSATIONS WITH THE FOOD PANTRY, HAS BEEN TO DONATE THE PROCESSED VENISON TO THEM.
AND THERE HAS BEEN NO INDICATION OF, OF KIND OF A, A NEGATIVE FEELING OR, UM, ANYTHING THAT WOULD OTHERWISE CHANGE, UH, THE PLAN FOR, FOR DONATING THAT PROCESS.
OKAY, JONATHAN? YEAH, AND I WOULD ADD, I SPOKE WITH LINDSAY WISEAU ABOUT THAT, AND THEY'RE VERY EXCITED ABOUT THAT OPPORTUNITY, ACCORDING TO HER.
SO SHE'S CHIEF, UH, COMMUNICATIONS OFFICER HERE.
SO, UM, THIS QUESTION'S ABOUT HOW CAN YOU CALL THE HERD ROAMING WELLINGTON PLACE AND WELLINGTON RESERVES.
WE'RE GETTING SOME SPECIFIC NEIGHBORHOOD QUESTIONS.
UM, FOLKS ARE SEEING THESE IN THEIR NEIGHBORHOODS.
UM, THIS PERSON LISTS A BUNCH OF, UM, CONCERNS AND OBSERVATIONS, CAN'T SAFELY GO IN OUR BACKYARD DUE TO AGGRESSIVE DEER, DEER, UM, BROWSE AREAS IN THE BACKYARD, CAR ACCIDENT NEAR MISSES.
SO I SUPPOSE MAYBE THE QUESTION IS ABOUT FOLKS WHO HAVE SPECIFIC NEIGHBORHOOD CONCERNS, WHAT SHOULD THEY DO, UM, IF MAYBE THEIR LOCATION ISN'T ON THAT MAP? THAT'S A QUESTION FOR USDA
YEAH, I WOULD JUST OFFER, IF THERE'S ANY SAFETY CONCERNS AT ALL, THAT IS OBVIOUSLY WHERE WE WOULD COME IN.
SO WE WOULD RECOMMEND YOU CALL.
IF IT'S AN EMERGENCY, OBVIOUSLY CALL 9 1 1.
UH, BUT IF NOT, YOU CAN CALL OUR NON-EMERGENCY NUMBER, WHICH IS 8 8 9 1 1 1 2, AND WE CAN HAVE AN OFFICER COME OUT.
WE CAN TRY TO GET, UH, CONNECTED WITH THE DIVISION OF WILDLIFE AS WELL TO SEE HOW WE CAN SOLVE THAT PROBLEM.
BUT PLEASE DON'T HESITATE TO CALL IF THERE'S A SAFETY ISSUE.
ALRIGHT? WE HAVE, UM, SOMEBODY HERE THAT'S VOLUNTEERING THEIR PROPERTY.
WE HAVE SEEN THE NUMBER OF DEER GO FROM A COUPLE OF THEM TO NOW A 10 PLUS HERD.
THEY'VE DONE SIGNIFICANT DAMAGE TO OUR LANDSCAPE.
NOT TO MENTION I SEE THEM RUNNING ACROSS DUBLIN ROAD ALL THE TIME IN FRONT OF SPEEDING CARS.
I'D LIKE TO VOLUNTEER OUR PROPERTY FOR USE IN THIS EFFORT.
SO, MITCH, YOU WANNA, OR BRUCE? NO, NO.
SO AT THIS TIME, WE WILL NOT BE CONSIDERING THE USE OF, UM, PRIVATE RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES, BUT A, AS WE NOTED, UM, THIS, THIS PROGRAM WILL BE MAINTAINED THROUGH, THROUGH MANY YEARS.
AND AS THE PROGRAM, UM, KIND OF GOES THROUGH IT, ITS ANNUAL EVALUATIONS.
THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE MAY CONSIDER IN THE FUTURE.
I HAVE A COUPLE MORE QUESTIONS HERE, BUT JONATHAN, DO YOU HAVE, OKAY.
IT'S ACTUALLY FROM THE SAME QUESTIONER, KNOWING THAT THE DEER ONLY MOVE IN THEIR SET PATHS, HOW DO I KNOW THAT SOME OF MY DEER WILL BE REMOVED? I HAVE THAT SAME QUESTION, BRISTOL COMMONS.
HOW DO I KNOW MY DEER ARE GONNA BE REMOVED? WELL, YOU DON'T.
UM, YEAH, BUT I MEAN, IT'S SO INTERESTING TO SEE THE WAY PEOPLE RELATE TO DEER ACROSS THE LANDSCAPE.
AND SO, SO WHAT USDA WILDLIFE SERVICES IS IT GONNA DO AT ANY GIVEN TIME? THEY'RE GONNA BE MONITORING DEER AT ALL THE LOCATIONS WHERE THEY THINK THEY CAN REMOVE DEER.
AND THEN THE NIGHT THAT THEY'RE PLANNING TO DO IT
I MEAN, I THINK THE HOPE IS THAT OVER TIME, OF COURSE, THAT DEER REMOVAL HAS A, EVENTUALLY A CUMULATIVE EFFECT.
BUT YEAH, IT'S ABSOLUTELY CORRECT.
LIKE, JUST BECAUSE OF A HUNDRED OR 125 DEER GET REMOVED IN DUBLIN IN THE FIRST YEAR DOESN'T MEAN THEY'RE GONNA GET THE DEER THAT ARE IN THEIR YARD.
[00:55:01]
THIS IS ACTUALLY WHY A LOT OF COMMUNITIES HAVE A COMBINATION PROGRAM OF TARGETED REMOVAL AND, UH, REGULATED ARCHERY PROGRAM.AND THEN AGAIN, SAME THING, THE SAME THING THAT USDA DOES TO APPROVE PROPERTIES AS A SAFE PLACE FOR TARGETED REMOVAL, YOU'D DO THE SAME THING.
YOU WOULD ONLY APPROVE PROPERTIES WHERE OUR TREE HUNTING COULD SAFELY BE DONE.
BUT WHAT THAT DOES IS IT TENDS TO ALLOW, AND AGAIN, WORTHINGTON IS USING RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES.
BUT WHAT THAT DOES IS IT SPREADS THE DEER REMOVAL OUT ACROSS MORE THAN JUST, YOU KNOW, A SMALLER NUMBER OF PUBLIC PARCELS.
AND THAT PUTS THAT PREDATION PRESSURE OR THE BEHAVIOR CHANGE A LITTLE BIT MORE DISPERSED.
AND SO THIS IS ONE OF THE REASONS WHY A LOT OF THOSE 74 COMMUNITIES IN OHIO THAT DO DEER REMOVAL PROGRAMS DO ALSO INCLUDE AN ARCHERY PROGRAM.
OR SOME OF THEM ONLY HAVE AN ARCHERY PROGRAM AND DON'T HAVE TARGETED REMOVAL.
SO IT ALSO IS A LOT LESS EXPENSIVE.
'CAUSE YOU KNOW, HUNTERS WILL PAY TO BE SOMEONE WHO CAN COME IN AND, YOU KNOW, SHOOT DEER, BUT, YOU KNOW, HIGHLY REGULATED.
UM, YOU CAN'T EVEN DO THAT IF YOU DON'T SHOW UP TO THE PROFICIENCY TEST AND SHOW THAT YOU CAN HIT A VERY SMALL TARGET FIVE TIMES IN A ROW, FIRST TIME OUTTA THE GATE.
OTHERWISE YOU'RE NOT A GOOD ENOUGH ARCHER
YOU KNOW, DUBLIN, IF DUBLIN EVER DID THAT, DUBLIN WOULD HAVE TO COME UP WITH ALL THE REGULATIONS THEY WANTED TO CREATE TO MAKE SURE THAT WAS DONE SAFELY, NUMBER ONE, AND THAT IT WOULD HAVE A POSITIVE IMPACT ON REDUCING DEER NUMBERS TOO.
SO, SO WE HAD A QUESTION COME IN ONLINE.
UM, WHY ARE YOU NOT USING FERTILITY CONTROL INSTEAD OF, UH, CULLING? AND I KNOW WE TALKED ABOUT THIS AT THE LAST MEETING, SO BARBARA, I THINK THAT'S TO YOU, THE FERTILITY PROGRAMS. WELL, FIRST OF ALL, UM, SOME OF THEM ARE VERY LIMITED.
THE STATE OF OHIO ONLY ALLOWS SOME OF THOSE PROGRAMS UNDER A RESEARCH PRO PRO PROGRAM.
I KNOW DOWN IN, UM, A CINCINNATI SUBURB, THEY GOT PERMITS TO DO, UH, SOME FERTILITY CONTROL.
SO THAT'S ONE OF THE MAIN THINGS.
UM, THOSE DEER ARE, UH, THEY ALSO, YOU KNOW, GO THROUGH A PRETTY, UM, STRESSFUL PROCESS OF HAVING TO BE DARTED TRANQUILIZED.
UH, THEY MIGHT BE SPAYED OR THEY MIGHT BE GIVEN A BIRTH CONTROL PRODUCT, AND THEN THEY'RE EAR TAGGED.
SO WE'D HAVE A LOT OF DEER RUNNING AROUND DOUBLING WITH EAR TAGS.
BUT DEER IN OUR CITY IMMIGRATE AND IMMIGRATE CONSTANTLY.
SO IT'S NOT NECESSARILY VERY EFFECTIVE BECAUSE YOU REALLY NEED TO CONTROL CONTRACEPTIVE CONTROL AT LEAST 75 TO 80% OF YOUR DOSE.
IT'S ABOUT A THOUSAND DOLLARS, $1,500 A DEER, SOMETIMES MORE DEPENDING ON WHAT METHOD YOU WOULD TRY TO USE.
SO IT WORKS REALLY GREAT IN ISLAND COMMUNITIES WHERE THERE'S NOT A LOT OF ABILITY FOR DEER TO MOVE IN AND OUT.
IT'S NOT VERY EFFECTIVE IN AN OPEN, UH, COMMUNITY LIKE OURS.
I HAVE TWO PEOPLE THAT ASK VERY NEARLY THE SAME QUESTION.
WHAT IS THE NUMBER OF DEER THAT WILL BE REMOVED THROUGH THIS PROGRAM, AND HOW DO YOU KNOW IT'S THE RIGHT AMOUNT? HOW DO YOU KNOW WHEN YOU'VE SUCCEEDED? AND SPECIFICALLY IN WORTHINGTON, HOW DID THEY PICK 100? YEAH.
WELL, I'VE, SO WE'VE TALKED ABOUT HOW WE TRY TO AVOID SETTING A NUMBER.
UH, I'VE GOT THIS QUOTE FROM THE ODNR FOLKS THAT IMPLYING OR SETTING EXPECTATIONS THAT DEER MANAGEMENT IS A CLEAN CUT AND PRECISE MATTER OF DETERMINING, AND THEN REMOVING A SPECIFIC NUMBER OF DEER IS A RECIPE FOR CONFUSION AND FUTURE INFLEXIBILITY, UH, BECAUSE OF THE VARIATION IN NUMBERS, BECAUSE DEER COME IN AND OUT JUST AS, AS BARBARA WAS SAYING.
BUT THAT SAID, YOU STILL CAN MAKE AN ESTIMATE OF POPULATION NUMBERS AND BASED ON THE EXPERIENCE.
SO JEFF WESTERFIELD IS ONE OF THE BIOLOGISTS WHO WORKS FOR THE STATE AND HAS BEEN INVOLVED WITH A LOT OF THE COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE REMOVED DEER.
SO OVER TIME YOU LOOK AT SIMILAR POPULATIONS, SIMILAR LANDSCAPES, AND YOU SAY, OKAY, THAT COMMUNITY TOOK A HUNDRED DEER.
AND, AND ONCE THEY DID THAT FOR THREE TO FIVE YEARS, IT ACTUALLY WORKED OUT FOR THEM.
SO THEY, THEY DO SET UP SOME NUMBERS AND THEY CHART OUT THOSE NUMBERS, NOT BECAUSE THOSE NUMBERS ARE ABSOLUTELY CORRECT OR TRUE, LIKE NUMBERS OF EXACTLY HOW MANY DEER WE HAVE, BECAUSE THAT'S A SORT OF A GOOD TARGET RANGE THAT WE THINK IS GONNA BE ABOUT RIGHT FOR THIS PARTICULAR COMMUNITY.
SO A HUNDRED TO 125 IS THE NUMBER THAT GOT SET FOR WORTHINGTON.
IT'S SIMILARLY SET FOR DUBLIN THIS COMING YEAR.
FRANKLY, THE BIOLOGISTS ARE ACTUALLY THINK THE NUMBERS SHOULD BE HIGHER THAN THAT IF WE REALLY WANT TO HAVE AS MUCH IMPACT AS YOU WOULD WANT TO HAVE OVER OVER TIME.
AT THE SAME TIME, THERE'S SOMETHING TO BE SAID FOR GETTING A PROGRAM STARTED, MAKING SURE THAT IT WORKS, THAT YOU CAN DO IT SAFELY, THAT YOU KNOW, THE, THE LOGISTICS OF IT ALL WORKS.
SO I THINK WE WERE VERY CONCERNED IN WORTHINGTON MAKE SURE THAT WE DON'T OVERDO IT AT FIRST.
LET'S TRY TO EASE THIS IN A LITTLE BIT AND MAKE SURE THAT IT'S COMPLETELY SAFE AND, AND ALL OF THOSE KINDS OF THINGS.
SO THOSE NUMBERS ARE BASED ON SORT OF BEST PRACTICES OF THE PEOPLE WHO ARE INVOLVED WITH MAKING THE DECISIONS.
ABOUT HOW MANY DEER DO YOU THINK YOU HAVE TO REMOVE IN THIS COMMUNITY BASED ON THE NUMBERS WE SEE WITH THE POPULATION INDEXES.
BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN IT'S AN EXACT NUMBER AND THAT THEY'RE EXACTLY RIGHT.
YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU DO HAVE TO CONTINUE TO WATCH,
[01:00:01]
UH, AND SEE HOW THESE POPULATION TRENDS GO OVER TIME AND CONTINUE TO ADJUST.HOPEFULLY YOU REACH A POINT WHERE MAINTENANCE OF THE NUMBER OF DEER IS A LOT EASIER.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO TAKE SO MANY DEER TO KIND OF KEEP IT WHERE YOU WANT IT.
AND SO THERE IS SORT OF A BALANCE, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF VARIABLES AND IT'S, IT'S, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT JUST EASY TO DO.
UM, SO YOU JUST DO HAVE TO KIND OF KEEP THE MANAGEMENT GOING AND, AND MEASURING ALL THESE THINGS.
AND I'D LIKE TO FOLLOW UP ON THAT REALLY QUICKLY FOR CLARITY, AS DR.
HEUS SUGGESTED, UM, THAT IS A NUMBER THAT WAS DETERMINED BY THE WILDLIFE EXPERTS THAT WE'VE CONTRACTED WITH AT USDA, UM, IN ACCORDANCE WITH BEST PRACTICES BOTH IN THE REGION AND AROUND THE STATE.
JONATHAN AND BRUCE, DO YOU HAVE ANOTHER ONE ONLINE? NO,
UH, THIS IS ANOTHER SPECIFIC QUESTION.
I THINK WE'VE SPOKEN ABOUT IT A LITTLE BIT, BUT THIS PERSON SAYS, SINCE WELLINGTON PLACE HAS A WOODED AREA INSIDE ITS BOUNDARY, COULD THOSE WOODS BE USED AS A TARGETED AREA? I KNOW THE USDA HELPS DETERMINE THAT AND MIGHT BE THE BEST PERSON TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION.
UM, BUT IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE YOU GUYS WOULD ADD? I DON'T THINK SO, OTHER THAN AGAIN, THEY'RE SERVING, UH, AREAS WHERE THEY'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO HAVE THE BEST OPPORTUNITY TO ALSO REMOVE THOSE DEER.
SO THERE MIGHT BE PLENTY OF DEER GOING THROUGH WELLINGTON.
ARE THEY GOING THROUGH THERE WHEN THE AREAS ARE BEING SURVEYED BY USDA? I MEAN, THEY'RE SO GOOD AT THIS.
THEY KNOW EXACTLY WHERE THEY SHOULD BE.
UH, TARGETING DEER, MAYBE DEER IN WELLINGTON.
MOST DEER HAVE A MILE TO FIVE MILE CIRCLE THAT THEY, UH, TRAVEL PRETTY REGULARLY.
THOSE DEER ARE ALSO GOING THROUGH OTHER AREAS.
AND SO THOSE DEER MAY BE TARGETED IN A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT AREA, BUT THEY ARE QUOTE WELLINGTON DEER, IF THAT MAKES SENSE.
SO DO WE HAVE EVERYBODY'S WRITTEN COMMENTS SO FAR? IS THERE ANY MORE THAT WE NEED TO PICK UP IF, AND JONATHAN MAY HAVE ANOTHER QUESTION COMING UP.
IF YOU HAVE ANOTHER QUESTION OR COMMENT, YOU ARE WELCOME TO FILL OUT ANOTHER FORM AND WE CAN GO DEEPER.
I JUST ASK YOU TO WRITE IT ON THE FORM FIRST.
I DON'T HAVE ANOTHER ONE,
DOES ANYBODY NEED ANOTHER BLANK FORM? THANK YOU.
YOU DO YOU NEED ONE? YOU HAVEN'T GIVEN ME ANYTHING YET, HAVE YOU? OKAY.
THERE WAS JUST A QUESTION ABOUT HOW LONG THE PROGRAM WILL RUN.
CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, BUT NOVEMBER TO MARCH AND THEN THIS IS GOING TO BE AN ONGOING CONVERSATION WHERE THINGS WILL BE REVISITED, RIGHT, MITCH? YEAH, THAT'S CORRECT.
SO IT'LL COMMENCE ON NOVEMBER 1ST AND THEN END ON MARCH 31ST.
AGAIN, THOUGH, THOSE OPERATIONS WILL TAKE PLACE INTERMITTENTLY AND AS NEEDED.
SO, UM, IT COULD END EARLIER THAN MARCH 31ST.
THAT IS JUST THE, UH, THE TERM OF OUR CONTRACT FOR THESE OPERATIONS.
JACKIE, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR YOU.
THERE WAS A SLIDE THAT TALKED ABOUT THE DIFFERENT NOTIFICATIONS.
CAN YOU GO OVER SOME OF THOSE AND ALSO REMIND PEOPLE THAT THEY CAN GO TO THE WEBSITE AND WE'LL KEEP COMPILING FAQS? DEFINITELY, YEP.
ON OUR CITY WEBPAGE, UM, WE HAVE ON OUR CITY WEBSITE WE HAVE A WEBPAGE FOR OUR DEAR MANAGEMENT PROGRAM.
AND ON THERE YOU CAN FIND, UM, A LOT OF HELPFUL FAQS, UM, RECORDING FROM THE LAST PUBLIC MEETING.
AND THEN THIS ONE WILL ALSO BE UP THERE AND THERE'S ALSO A BUTTON ON THERE TO SUBMIT A QUESTION THAT WILL COME TO US.
SO IF SOMETHING COMES UP AFTER AND YOU THAT YOU DIDN'T THINK OF TONIGHT, FEEL FREE TO SUBMIT IT THERE.
WE ALSO HAVE ON THAT WEBPAGE, UM, THAT LINKS OUT TO OUR DEAR AND DUBLIN PAGE.
AND THAT WEBPAGE CONSISTS OF A LOT OF HELPFUL DOCUMENTS THAT, YOU KNOW, ARE KIND OF, UM, THAT ARE INCLUDED FROM YEARS PAST, JUST DIFFERENT CONVERSATIONS.
WE HAD DIFFERENT, UM, SURVEYS AND DATA.
SO THE WEBSITE IS A GREAT PLACE TO START.
AND THAT QR CODE IS ON THE ONE PAGER THAT WAS AT THE FRONT DESK.
AND THEN JUST TO HIT ON SOME OF THE COMMUNICATIONS TO COME AND, UM, COMMUNICATIONS THAT WE'VE ALREADY DONE, WE WILL HAVE A CITYWIDE MAILER GOING OUT BEFORE OPERATIONS BEGIN.
UM, AND WE WILL ALSO HAVE SIGNS POSTED AT THE LOCATIONS WHEN OPERATIONS ARE HAPPENING AND WE WILL HAVE UPDATES ON OUR WEBSITE AND SOCIAL MEDIA.
AND DID YOU MENTION THE SIGNAGE? YES.
WE WILL HAVE THE SIGNAGE POSTED, UM, AT THE ENTRY TO THE PARKS AND THE OPERATION LOCATIONS.
I GOT DISTRACTED FOR A MINUTE WITH THIS QUESTION 'CAUSE I ASKED ODNR THE SAME QUESTION WHEN THEY WERE HERE AT THE LAST PUBLIC MEETING.
WHY HASN'T ODNR INCREASED THE NUMBER OF DEER THAT HUNTERS OR ONE PERSON CAN HUNT PER YEAR SINCE THERE'S BEEN SUCH AN INCREASE IN POPULATION?
[01:05:02]
NOW I KNOW ONE THING HE TOLD ME, BUT I'LL WAIT AND SEE IF YOU WANNA ADD ANYTHING.SO, SO, YOU KNOW, EVERY YEAR HUNTERS, WHETHER YOU'RE A BOW HUNTER OR A A GUN, UH, HUNTER, YOU HAVE A LIMIT OF HOW MANY DEER YOU CAN GET.
SO WHY HAVEN'T THEY EXPANDED THAT? WELL, YOU MAY KNOW BETTER THAN I, BARBARA, BUT IN SOME CASES THEY HAVE.
THERE'S A COUNTY BY COUNTY LIMIT.
SOME COUNTIES WILL ALLOW YOU TWO DEER, SOME WILL ALLOW YOU THREE, SOME WILL ALLOW FOUR, I THINK IS THE MAXIMUM.
ANY HUNTER IN OHIO CAN TAKE UP TO SIX DEER PER YEAR.
SO YOU CAN'T GET 'EM ALL IN THE SAME COUNTY.
'CAUSE YOU CAN ONLY GET TWO, THREE OR FOUR IN CERTAIN COUNTIES.
YOU'RE ONLY ALLOWED TO TAKE ONE ANTLER, UH, DEER OUT OF THOSE SIX.
SO YOU CAN TAKE FIVE THOSE AND ONE BUCK BASICALLY.
UM, ONE OF THE SHIFTS THAT'S HAPPENED, WHERE ARE THE PLACES WHERE YOU CAN TAKE FOUR DEER PER COUNTY? IT'S ALL AROUND CLEVELAND, CINCINNATI, AND COLUMBUS.
YOU KNOW, THE COUNTIES THAT SURROUND THE, THOSE AREAS.
UM, SO, UH, SO SOME SHIFTING HAS GONE ON THERE TO INCREASE THE, FROM LIKE TWO TO THREE OR THREE TO FOUR IN A FEW COUNTIES TO KIND OF BUMP THE NUMBERS UP.
'CAUSE THE VAST MAJORITY OF HUNTERS DON'T TAKE SIX DEER.
THE VAST MAJORITY TAKE ONE OR TWO AT MOST.
UM, SO THE FACT THAT YOU CAN TAKE THREE OR FOUR IS USUALLY NOT THE LIMITING FACTOR FOR MOST DEER.
LIKE THE SIZE OF YOUR FREEZER IS KIND OF THE LIMITING, YOU KNOW, IF YOU CAN EAT THREE DEER, YOU, YOU HAVE A BIG APPETITE.
BARBARA, DID YOU WANNA WEIGH IN? I WAS JUST GONNA ADD THAT IN.
IN OHIO, UM, WE HAVE A LOT LESS HUNTERS THAN WE USED TO HAVE IS A REAL PROBLEM AS FAR AS ARE WE GOING TO BE ABLE TO MANAGE DEER WITH HUNTING ALONE? IT'S PROBABLY NOT GONNA HAPPEN.
AND SOME OF THAT IS LACK OF, UH, PERMISSION.
THERE'S A LOT OF PLACES NOW YOU CAN'T GET PERMISSION TO HUNT ANYTHING, LET ALONE DEER.
SO, UH, PRIVATE LANDOWNERS HAVE KIND OF CUT OFF SOME, UH, PROPERTIES OR PROPERTIES BEING USED FOR SOMETHING ELSE.
SO THERE'S LESS, LESS OPPORTUNITY IN SOME CASES.
AND THE STATE HUNTING LANDS, YOU KNOW, THEY, THEY GET OVER HUNTED, SO TO SPEAK.
UM, HUNTERS AREN'T GONNA MAKE A TRIP THREE HOURS TO ONE OF THE STATE PROPERTIES IF IT'S OVER HUNTED BECAUSE THEIR CHANCES OF GETTING A DEER ARE NOT VERY GOOD
SO THERE'S A WHOLE COMBINATION OF ISSUES GOING ON AS FAR AS, UH, HOW HUNTERS ARE HUNTING AND, AND MOST HUNTERS ARE TRYING TO FILL THEIR FREEZER.
THEY'RE NOT HUNTING EXTRA ANIMALS UNLESS THEY NECESSARILY HAVE SOMEBODY TO GIVE THE MEAT TO.
UM, SO THAT COULD BE AN ISSUE TOO.
BUT THERE'S A LOT OF OHIOANS WHO RELY ON DEER MEAT THROUGH THE WINTER ESPECIALLY.
SO I DON'T KNOW THAT, UH, PEOPLE REALIZE HOW MUCH VENISON IS A IMPORTANT PART OF, UH, DIET IN OHIOANS.
THE OR REPRESENTATIVE ECHOED MANY OF THE THINGS THAT YOU SAID, AND HIS OBSERVATION WAS THAT HUNTING JUST CULTURALLY HAS GONE WAY DOWN IN THE LAST 40 YEARS OF SHOWING AN INTEREST IN HUNTING AND RAISING YOUR KIDS TO HUNT.
WHEN YOU DO HUNT, YOU TEND TO WANNA GET A BUCK.
SO IT DOESN'T HELP REDUCE THAT PROGRESSION OF GROWTH.
SO THOSE WERE JUST SOME OF HIS COMMENTS.
NOW, THERE ARE, IF YOU'RE A LANDOWNER OF A FARM OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, THERE ARE EXCEPTIONS YOU CAN GO FOR ADDITIONAL PERMITTING OR PERMISSIONS TO TAKE MORE ANIMALS OUT ON YOUR LAND.
I'LL JUST ADD THAT THE, THE CULLING PROGRAMS, THE TARGETED REMOVAL REALLY DOES PRIORITIZE THOSE, UH, FOR THOSE REASONS.
'CAUSE IT HAS SO MUCH OF A HIGHER IMPACT ON REDUCING POPULATION NUMBERS.
IT KIND OF JUST DOESN'T MATTER THAT MUCH TO TAKE A BUCK COMPARED TO TAKING A DOUGH.
AND IN WORTHINGTON, I THINK THE NUMBERS WERE 90% WERE, UM, NON ANTLER AND, AND 10% ANTLER THAT THEY TOOK AS IN THE STATS FROM THE WORTHINGTON.
SO THAT IS ONE PLACE WHERE THE TARGETED REMOVAL DOES SOMETHING DIFFERENT THAN HUNTING TENDS TO DO IN TERMS OF TAKING MORE DOUGH OFF THE LANDSCAPE.
I ALSO SAY THERE ARE OTHER HUNTERS THAT HAVE DECLINED ARE THE PREDATORS.
UH, YOU KNOW, AT THE SAME TIME WE GOT RID OF DEER IN OHIO BACK IN THE EARLY 19 HUNDREDS.
WE'D ALREADY GOTTEN RID OF WOLVES.
WE'D ALREADY GOTTEN RID OF AT THE TIME BOBCATS LINK.
UM, WE DO HAVE PLENTY OF COYOTES, BUT THEY DON'T TAKE A LOT OF DEER.
UM, BLACK BEARS, RIGHT? SO ALL OF THE NATURAL PREDATORS OF DEER HAVE BEEN REMOVED FROM THE LANDSCAPE AND WE DON'T SEEM THAT EAGER TO REPLACE THEM LIKE WE WERE EAGER TO REPLACE THE DEER
UM, SO THE FACT THAT WE HAVE LESS HUMAN HUNTERS, BUT WE ALSO DON'T HAVE THE NATURAL OTHER NATURAL PREDATOR HUNTERS ON THE LANDSCAPE THAT MAKES A DIFFERENCE.
AND IF YOU LOOK AT PLACES LIKE YELLOWSTONE WHERE THEY'VE REINTRODUCED WOLVES, REALLY FASCINATING ECOLOGICAL STUFF HAS HAPPENED THERE, RIGHT? THEY BRING THE WOLVES BACK IN.
AND ONE OF THE THINGS THAT HAPPENED THAT THEY WEREN'T NECESSARILY EXPECTING WAS THAT THE WOLVES ARE GOING AFTER THE ELK.
AND WHERE DO THE ELK NORMALLY HANG OUT? WELL, DOWN IN THE RIVER BOTTOMS, EATING THE WILLOW BUSHES.
BUT NOW THAT THERE'S WOLVES LURKING AROUND THERE, THE ELK ARE LIKE, WHOOP GOING TO OTHER PLACES.
AND SUDDENLY ALL THE WILLOW TREES WERE ABLE TO GROW AGAIN, THE WILLOW BUSHES.
AND THAT BROUGHT BEAVERS BACK IN.
'CAUSE THEN THEY HAD A FOOD SOURCE AND THE BEAVERS CREATED PONDS, WHICH ENHANCED BIODIVERSITY.
[01:10:01]
THIS WHOLE ECOSYSTEM REALITY THAT HAD ALWAYS BEEN THE WAY IT HAD BEEN AT YELLOWSTONE.WE DIDN'T REALIZE HOW OUTTA WHACK IT WAS UNTIL IT LET THE WOLVES BACK IN AND SUDDENLY IT KIND OF WENT BACK TO NORMAL, IF YOU WILL.
THAT'S A LITTLE BIT LIKE WHAT OUR DAIRY, LIKE.
I KNOW WHAT GABE SAYS ABOUT HIS LANDSCAPE ECOLOGIST WHO STUDIES DEER HABITAT.
HE SAYS, WE HAVE NO IDEA HOW CHANGED OUR ECOLOGICAL LANDSCAPE IS IN OHIO BECAUSE WE'VE NEVER SEEN IT THE WAY IT WAS ORIGINALLY OR SUPPOSED TO BE.
IT'S KIND OF LIKE THE YELLOWSTONE SITUATION.
SO I THINK IT'D BE FASCINATING.
LIKE PERSONALLY, I THINK THAT THIS ATTENTION TO HABITAT, ATTENTION TO DEER, ATTENTION TO COMMUNITY HEALTH AND, AND PARTICULARLY EVEN ATTENTION TO THE WELLBEING OF DEER, FOR THOSE WHO DON'T PARTICULARLY LIKE THE IDEA OF DEER BEING REMOVED, ALL OF THOSE CONCERNS COMBINED TO PAY MORE ATTENTION TO THINGS THAT REALLY MATTER ABOUT THE OVERALL HEALTH OF OUR LANDSCAPE.
AND I THINK IF WE CONTINUE TO LISTEN TO EACH OTHER AND THINK ABOUT AN ITERATIVE PROCESS WHERE EVERY YEAR YOU REEVALUATE AND SEE WHAT HAS HAPPENED AND TRY TO MAKE IMPROVEMENTS ON WHAT HAPPENED LAST YEAR.
AND AT THE SAME TIME, I THINK WE'RE ALL BECOMING MORE AWARE OF WILDLIFE, WE'RE BECOMING MORE AWARE OF ECOLOGY AND, AND OTHER PLANTS AND THE VEGETATION.
THOSE ARE OUTCOMES OF, YOU KNOW, DEER MANAGEMENT PROGRAMS THAT I, I THINK ARE POSITIVES THAT WE CAN TAKE EVEN IF, EVEN IF PEOPLE DISAGREE ABOUT, YOU KNOW, WHETHER THEY WANNA SEE THIS OR NOT.
UH, THAT'S A, THAT'S A POSITIVE OUTCOME ANYWAY.
AS WE'VE LEARNED ABOUT THIS PROGRAM, I'VE BEEN KIND OF STRUCK BY, UM, HOW THE BEHAVIOR OF THE DEER MAY CHANGE DURING THIS PROCESS.
WE MAY HAVE TALKED ABOUT THIS A LITTLE BIT, BUT THE TWO SESSIONS ARE KIND OF MIXING UP TOGETHER, BUT I'M NOT SURE IF YOU GUYS COULD SPEAK TO THAT.
WHAT, WHAT DO RESIDENTS ACROSS DUBLIN, UM, WHAT SHOULD THEY EXPECT TO SEE WITH THE DEER AS THIS PROGRAM'S GOING ON? AGAIN, IT MAY TAKE A LITTLE BIT OF TIME, BUT SOME OF THE GENERATIONAL KNOWLEDGE THAT'S BEING PASSED DOWN NOW THAT'S FAIRLY NEGATIVE TOWARD US, UH, SHOULD SHIFT.
AND THOSE DEER SHOULD BECOME A LITTLE MORE WARY.
AND AS A DOE BECOMES MORE WARY, HER FAWNS ARE GOING TO LEARN TO BE MORE WARY.
AND THAT'S GONNA BE A REALLY IMPORTANT, UM, KNOWLEDGE PASSING DOWN AMONG THOSE FEMALES.
AND OF COURSE, FEMALE FAWNS TEND TO STAY WITH THEIR FEMALE HERD THAT THEIR MOTHER'S IN AND THEIR AUNT'S IN AND THEIR GRANDMOTHER'S IN.
SO THEY, THEY KEEP THAT KNOWLEDGE AND THEY LIVE 20 YEARS IN, IN A CITY ENVIRONMENT IF, IF THEY DON'T GET INTO TROUBLE SOME OTHER WAY, CAUGHT ON A FENCE OR, OR STRUCK BY A CAR OR SOMETHING.
SO THEY'RE LIVING A VERY LONG TIME.
AND WE WANT THOSE FAWNS TO BE LEARNING THE RIGHT BEHAVIORS FROM A YOUNG AGE OF BEING A LITTLE BIT RESPECTFUL OF HUMANS AND WARY.
UH, SAME THING WE, WE TEACH PEOPLE ABOUT THE COYOTES.
IF YOU HAVE COYOTE PUPS COMING UP TOWARDS YOUR DECK TO EXPERIMENT WITH, YOU KNOW, SEEING YOUR DOG IN THE WINDOW OR SOMETHING, GET OUT THERE AND CHASE HIM OFF, HAZE HIM AS A BABY SO THAT HE LEARNS FROM A VERY YOUNG AGE.
YOU SEE A HUMAN, YOU NEED TO GIVE THEM A CERTAIN WIDE BER.
AND WE'VE DONE THAT WITH A LOT OF COYOTE PUPS IN WEDGEWOOD, LET ME TELL YOU.
BARBARA, YOU KEEP USING THE WORD HAZING.
IS THAT HOW YOU'RE SAYING IT? YEAH, HAZING.
H-A-Z-I-N-G BECAUSE HAZING HAS A LOT OF NEGATIVE CONNOTATIONS RIGHT NOW.
SO USING THAT WORD HAS JUST KIND OF BEEN INTERESTING TO ME.
BUT IS THAT A, IN BIOLOGY, IT'S A TERM WE USE OF A, A SAFE WAY FOR THE HUMAN AND THE ANIMAL TO TEACH THE ANIMAL TO GIVE US SOME SPACE.
SO IT'S, IT'S LITERALLY SCARING THEM OFF, WHETHER YOU'RE WAVING THEM.
UM, I USE A SHAKER, CAN I HAVE A PLASTIC EMPTY BOTTLE WITH, UM, DIMES IN IT? AND WHEN YOU SHAKE IT AS A VERY LOUD, AND I RECOMMEND THAT, UH, THESE MOMS WITH THEIR YOUNG KIDS, THEY'RE WORRIED ABOUT THE DEER STALKING THEM ON THEIR WALKS TO TAKE ONE OF THOSE WITH THEM.
IF YOU POP OPEN AN UMBRELLA AT A WILD ANIMAL THAT'S STANDING THERE STARING AT YOU OR APPROACHING YOU GENERALLY IS GOING TO STOP OR EVEN RUN AWAY.
SO THERE'S CERTAIN THINGS WE CAN DO, UM, THAT ARE CONSIDERED HAZING THE ANIMAL OR, OR CHASING HIM OFF.
SO YEAH, MAYBE WE NEED A DIFFERENT TERM.
I'M NOT CAUGHT UP ON ALL THAT
SO ANY MORE QUESTIONS ONLINE OR ANY MORE WRITTEN QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? OKAY.
LOOKS LIKE MAYBE SOMEBODY'S GONNA WRITE ANOTHER COMMENT.
WELL, I'LL, I'LL FILL IT WITH THE, THE QUESTION WAS HOW MANY YEARS ARE THEY GOING TO RUN THE PROGRAM? UM, I THINK THAT'S GENERALLY TO BE DETERMINED.
THERE ISN'T AN EXACT, I DON'T THINK THERE'S AN EXACT NUMBER THAT WE CAN PUT TO THAT AT THIS POINT, BUT IT'S A GOOD QUESTION.
YEAH, THE EXPECTATION IN WORTHINGTON IS YOU DON'T, YOU CAN'T JUST RUN IT FOR A YEAR OR TWO.
UM, SO IT'S A LONG-TERM PROSPECT.
[01:15:01]
IN ANY CASE, HOPEFULLY, LIKE I HAD SAID EARLIER, YOU GET TO A MAINTENANCE LEVEL THAT'S FAIRLY EASY AND THERE'S NOT A LOT OF NEED.YOU MAY NOT NEED TARGETED REMOVAL TO TAKE BIG NUMBERS, UM, IF YOU CAN TAKE SMALL AIR.
BUT, UM, BASICALLY THE WAY WE, THE WAY DEER HABITAT IS SO GOOD IN SUBURBAN AREAS, IF WE DON'T DO ANYTHING, DEER NUMBERS WILL JUST KEEP GOING UP.
I MEAN, UNLESS WE REALLY START DESTROYING HABITAT AGAIN.
BUT I THINK WE, YOU KNOW, WE'VE REALLY GOTTEN BETTER AT THAT.
WE LEARNED A LOT OF LESSONS FROM 120 YEARS AGO ABOUT WHAT NOT TO DO IF YOU WANT TO HAVE WILDLIFE ON THE LANDSCAPE.
SO WE'RE HOPEFULLY NOT GONNA REPEAT THOSE MISTAKES AGAIN.
UM, BUT BECAUSE WE HAVEN'T BEEN MANAGING FOR THIS KIND OF SUBURBAN EXPLOSION THAT WE MAYBE WEREN'T TOTALLY EXPECTING, UM, YOU CAN'T JUST DO NOTHING THAT'S, THOSE NUMBERS WILL JUST KEEP GOING UP.
SO IT IS A, IT IS A LONG-TERM THING, NOT BECAUSE WE DIDN'T GET AHEAD OF IT, BUT JUST BECAUSE THERE'S, THAT'S WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN.
THAT'S JUST THE BIOLOGY OF IT AND THE ECOLOGY OF IT.
SO BRUCE AND JACKIE, WITH YOUR PERMISSION, I'M GONNA GIVE IT BACK TO MITCH TO TELL US WHAT OUR NEXT STEPS ARE, AND WE'RE GONNA ADJOURN A LITTLE EARLY.
THE PANELISTS SAID THAT THEY WOULD STAY TILL SEVEN 30, SO WE WILL LEAVE THAT OPEN TO THE AUDIENCE IF THEY WANT TO TALK TO THEM AFTER YOU TELL US WHAT'S NEXT.
UM, SO WHAT'S NEXT, UH, IS THE START OF OUR COOPERATIVE SERVICE AGREEMENT WITH THE USDA.
IT'LL COMMENCE ON NOVEMBER ONE, AS I MENTIONED EARLIER, AND END ON MARCH 31ST, 2027.
UM, THANK YOU GUYS VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US TONIGHT AND ENGAGING WITH, WITH THESE CITY REPRESENTATIVES AS WELL AS, UH, OUR OUTSIDE EXPERT.
UM, THANK YOU AGAIN, AND IF THERE'S ANYTHING YOU NEED IN THE FUTURE, PLEASE DON'T HESITATE TO CONTACT ME.